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Cathryn
Joined: 16 Jul 2005
Posts: 13225
Location: Ceredigion
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 Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 1:46 pm Post subject: Well seasoned wood. |
 
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I have been given some good contacts (thank you Gervase) however the debate continues at home on whether it is possible to find really well seasoned timber. The current windows are at least early Victorian. They are battered by winter storms straight off the sea. Many (far too many) only need repair not replacing. The glass house on the protected side of the house was replaced about 40 years ago, the wood is almost completely gone on it. Any newer bit of wood on door frames is completely rotten.
What is different about these 100 year old and more windows that has made them last so well and will we be able to repeat whatever it was? |
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sean
Downsizer Moderator
Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28908
Location: North Devon
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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Wild guess here (heck, it's the internet, why not?):
Your hundred year old windows will have been painted (at least for the first half of their lives) with Lovely Breathable Traditional Paint which allowed the wood to go on seasoning in situ.
Your 1960/70s vinery timber will have been painted with Horrible Modern Petrochemical Based Stuff which didn't.
Probably a red herring: In the world of violin making there's some debate about whether the temperature when the trees were growing affects the quality of the wood. |
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Gervase
Joined: 17 Nov 2004
Posts: 7001
Location: Ceredigion, West Wales
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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Most modern softwoods are grown too fast, so they aren't as durable as the old stuff. If you look at the growth rings on an old piece of pitch pine they're a lot closer together than on a modern lump of wood.
Decent wood is still available - good joiners will use Douglas fir for doors and windows, and I've seen some excellent quality work recently.
Sean's right about the paint, too. Modern 'all weather' paints form a plastic seal around the wood, so any damp that gets in (an it will when the paint cracks or blisters) will remain and rot the wood. Older windows were painted with linseed oil paint, which is flexible and breathable. I use these paints and they're excellent. Don't be put off by the price - the coverage is vastly superior to modern vinyl and alkyd paints, and the finish lasts much, much longer. |
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Cathryn
Joined: 16 Jul 2005
Posts: 13225
Location: Ceredigion
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent points, thank you. The painting (frequency) discussion has come up.  |
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vegplot
Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 11132
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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Sean and Gervase have the issue covered really. Good quality timber and protection that allows it to breathe. Kiln dried fast grown timber is fine for indoor work (if kept dry) but externally a very poor performer. |
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Nick
Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 17531
Location: Hereford
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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Are you looking for a source of 100 year old Victorian timber suitable for turning into replacement windows? Our local salvage yard (and yours), must have tons of the stuff in its warehouse. Could be expensive, but think of the investment potential! |
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Cathryn
Joined: 16 Jul 2005
Posts: 13225
Location: Ceredigion
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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What investment potential? Explain?
I used to work with an antiques restorer who never threw away any wood, regularly dismantled furniture and stored it. I have considered that I could source timber this way. |
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dpack
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 13788
Location: w yorks /earth
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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im with nick on the reclaimed is better than new ,
a decent joiner can make any frames to fit
gervase's/sean's timber and paint thing is valid
a historical aside most victorian british building (softwood) timber was from cold climates in north europe or from canada and first cut in natural forrest rather than fast growing replacement crop |
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Nick
Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 17531
Location: Hereford
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| Posted: Tue Sep 22, 09 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Cathryn wrote: |
What investment potential? Explain?
I used to work with an antiques restorer who never threw away any wood, regularly dismantled furniture and stored it. I have considered that I could source timber this way. |
An investment is something you spend money, time or effort on for a return. You will spend lots of money buying timber this way, but the return on your investment will be a lack of draughts, well fitting windows, no storms in your lounge, a feeling of smug satsifaction and very, very good windows. |
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welshboy454
Joined: 21 May 2009
Posts: 92
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| Posted: Wed Sep 23, 09 8:22 am Post subject: |
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A tip given to me by a boat builder for painting new wood was to use loads of thinners with the primer and then give it loads of these diluted primer coats. The theory is that the thinner the primer the deeper it would be absorbed into the wood therefore ultimately protecting it better. |
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