Costing the Earth: Energy storage.

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Costing the Earth: Energy storage.
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Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Tue May 13, 14 2:38 pm Post subject: Costing the Earth: Energy storage.
Now playing on Radio 4...

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Tue May 13, 14 3:52 pm Post subject:
Compressed air in hollow salt caverns. Very interesting! And, the Sheffield firm, ITM, selling technology to the Germans for hydrogen storage are very interesting people. And customers.

baldybloke

Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 1388
Location: Wiltshire

Posted: Tue May 13, 14 5:08 pm Post subject:
Bang goes the Theory discussed liquidified air a while back. Looked really interesting. Listening to the programme on I Player at the moment.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Tue May 13, 14 8:36 pm Post subject:

Nick wrote:

Compressed air in hollow salt caverns. Very interesting!

Led me to think of all the abandoned mine workings around the place and whether any of those can be made airtight.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 45521
Location: yes

Posted: Tue May 13, 14 9:42 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

Nick wrote:

Compressed air in hollow salt caverns. Very interesting!

Led me to think of all the abandoned mine workings around the place and whether any of those can be made airtight.

mostly not imho

Shane

Joined: 31 Oct 2005
Posts: 3467
Location: Doha. Is hot.

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 3:52 am Post subject:

They were trialling the compressed air thing in the States a few years back, from memory (didn't listen to the programme - apologies if it was covered).

I'd think that pumping water up high and then using it run turbines on the way back down again must be more efficient - compressors waste a lot of energy by heating up the air that they compress. But then I guess you don't have to worry about 10% of your air evaporating, so maybe it's swings and roundabouts.

baldybloke

Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 1388
Location: Wiltshire

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 6:29 am Post subject:
Nobody is considering reducing the amount we consume and using what we have more efficiently.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 6:38 am Post subject:

Shane wrote:

The limit is that we don't have many high places we can shove a billion gallons of water without trashin the place. Underground is easier. A point they made is these are not either /or answers, we need multiple solutions.

Reduction is part of the issue, but not the brief of this show, to be fair.

Shane

Joined: 31 Oct 2005
Posts: 3467
Location: Doha. Is hot.

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 8:44 am Post subject:
Underground is only easier if you have a spare salt cavern lying around that hasn't been earmarked for gas storage...

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 9:00 am Post subject:
They were making them, in Northern Ireland.

vegplot

Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 21301
Location: Bethesda, Gwynedd

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 9:19 am Post subject:
I didn't listen to the programme but the way we generate and consume energy is very mis-matched. Did it discuss ways of better utilising the energy at the point of production to avoid costly storage?

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 9:26 am Post subject:
Nope, it was about Energy Storage, rather than avoiding it.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Wed May 14, 14 12:08 pm Post subject:
Because almost all of our renewable energy is neither constant nor under our control. I'm surprised they didn't mention flow batteries (unless I missed it). They seem like quite a good idea...

alison
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 12918
Location: North Devon

Posted: Thu May 15, 14 3:43 pm Post subject:

baldybloke wrote:

Nobody is considering reducing the amount we consume and using what we have more efficiently.

Agree

We are trying to have a plan to wean off of oil, but it is long term, as I cannot waste the 2 x oil boilers we have that are 10 years old. I was talking to the engineer yesterday, and it is definately something that is closer, as I think the life expectancy of our boiler is about 15 years.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Thu May 15, 14 4:42 pm Post subject:

alison wrote:

baldybloke wrote:

Nobody is considering reducing the amount we consume and using what we have more efficiently.

Agree

There was a discussion about it on the wireless some time back. I was proper annoyed with them because they cut it short for a non-discussion about poultry fraud.

Quote:

We are trying to have a plan to wean off of oil, but it is long term, as I cannot waste the 2 x oil boilers we have that are 10 years old. I was talking to the engineer yesterday, and it is definately something that is closer, as I think the life expectancy of our boiler is about 15 years.

Will it not burn biofuel?

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