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ash die back advice wanted
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dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 32886
Location: yes
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 11:32 am    Post subject: ash die back advice wanted  Reply with quote    

betty is a tiny bit of good news, that there may be 2 to 3% resistant trees is a little more.

is it good sense to leave the trees until very poorly before felling to find the resistant ones provide seed to restock ?

if 97% are probably going to die is there any point in trying to prevent spread with a pre emptive clear cut ?

97% will alter the mature treescape quite a bit but fortunately they do make a lot of seed and are easy(too easy in ones masonry etc) to propagate as well as being quite fast growers so perhaps we can leave a good number for the future.

i have been planting horse chestnuts from trees that seem resistant to the red death thing which has been killing them round here for quite a few years ,i was wondering if an ash plan would also be a good idea?

wellington womble



Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 14805
Location: East Midlands
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I keep wondering if there is anything I could do with mine. I've a lovely mature ash that I can see from bedroom window and I'm very fond of it. It's isolated - there aren't many other trees around, and no ash at all that I can see, so I'm hoping it will escape. I was going to fell it, but I like it too much, so I'm going to move the veg beds instead. That's means I will be in contravention of planning, but I can't see anyone complaining about my cabbages in the wrong place.

tahir



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 43925
Location: Essex
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 12:39 pm    Post subject: Re: ash die back advice wanted Reply with quote    

dpack wrote:
is it good sense to leave the trees until very poorly before felling to find the resistant ones provide seed to restock ?


Yes

Quote:
if 97% are probably going to die is there any point in trying to prevent spread with a pre emptive clear cut ?


No

Quote:
i have been planting horse chestnuts from trees that seem resistant to the red death thing which has been killing them round here for quite a few years ,i was wondering if an ash plan would also be a good idea?


Sounds like a good idea.

I took advice last year after noticing it here, the local FC advisor said that there's so much of it about now that there was very little point felling. Common sense says that if ash is as genetically diverse as they reckon then it's best to get as many offspring as possible.

Having said that they reckon it's not looking good for ash as we now also have sightings of emerald ash borer

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 32886
Location: yes
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

that was my thoughts .

a strong dose of darwinistic selection and replant with the offspring of the survivors does seem the best option in a bad situation.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 32886
Location: yes
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

perhaps the wee bug will starve before it gets the last few percent of the die back ones.

tahir



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 43925
Location: Essex
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

dpack wrote:
perhaps the wee bug will starve before it gets the last few percent of the die back ones.


Don't worry there's plenty more tree nasties on their way

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 32886
Location: yes
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 16 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

i read about some of them,a mix of imports and warm winters is a bad combo for pests and diseases of trees(and other victims)

Hairyloon



Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 14799
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 16 12:29 am    Post subject: Re: ash die back advice wanted Reply with quote    

tahir wrote:
dpack wrote:
is it good sense to leave the trees until very poorly before felling to find the resistant ones provide seed to restock ?


Yes

Quote:
if 97% are probably going to die is there any point in trying to prevent spread with a pre emptive clear cut ?


No

I am not disagreeing, but a more thorough and well thought out response is a damn sight more convincing.

NorthernMonkeyGirl



Joined: 10 Apr 2011
Posts: 4271
Location: Peeping over your shoulder
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 16 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Why? Succinct works. You won't find a resistant population if you've felled them all, and the spread is inevitable from what I hear, given the conditions and means of spreading.

tahir



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 43925
Location: Essex
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 16 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Sorry Hl but that seemed to be enough words in the context of the original post, my level of knowledge, and the fact that I was at work (actually working) when I posted

I'll try to post in a more fulsome style in future, maybe throw in loads of unsubstantiated speculation, a conspiracy theory or too, some paranoia and a bit of hysteria too.


Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 8739

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 16 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I would read the FC website for the latest advice, but I read a couple of papers that suggested leaving the affected stems will help wildlife dependant on ash for as long as possible. If there are only one or two stems affected, it might be worth cutting them out to clean wood aand burning them.

The main spore carrying medium is the leaf. Also, the more wind that can blow through the stems, the less chance of enough spores landing to start an infection. If you cut ash it will coppice, and new coppice reaches full adult immunity from about 10 years old.

Our ash trees tend to start butt rot at about 70 years old, so we are having to cut them otherwise they will fall over anyway. Our woods has many old coppice stools in it, and if the lot go it will be a cultural and historical as well as an ecological disaster. Hoping we have plenty of resistant ones.

Tahir, I didn't know emerald ash borer had been seen in the UK. I knew it was a major threat through. Must read up on it. That's the last thing we want.

tahir



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 43925
Location: Essex
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 16 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

MR that really is the tip of the iceberg, I've been saying for years that we're due something that affects rosaceae, xylella fastidium (spp?) has the potential as well as numerous other genera. It's wreaking havoc in olive groves in Italy at the moment.

I reckon the amount of plant material (dead and alive) that gets imported and the changing climate means we will inevitably introduce some dreadful pests and diseases in the next couple of decades.

Jamanda
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Posts: 34886
Location: Devon
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 16 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Don't forget the Oaks!

http://www.forestry.gov.uk/pdf/EPAversion3.pdf/$FILE/EPAversion3.pdf

It seems consensus is we're stuffed.

Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 8739

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 16 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I went to a seminar on Pests and Diseases in Woodlands with our son a couple of years ago, and yes, it is frightening. The FC are very worried about it all, but trying to get government to see how serious it is is an uphill struggle. All they see is free trade. Restrictions can be applied, as they have been in the case of ash at the moment.

Sudden oak death is less likely to affect British oak trees, but will affect other trees like beech and other thin barked trees.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 32886
Location: yes
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 16 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

ahhhh wasps

i will have a look for the list of high risk nasties ,how to spot em/how to kill em etc

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