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Ty Gwyn

A different kind of landscaping project needed.

https://youtu.be/DzwW6irR5O4
Nick

Where’s this? Looks messy.
Ty Gwyn

Skewen near Neath,not far from the A465 junction off the M4.
dpack

toxic and a surprise from the middle of a road.nasty.

i met one of those in south yorks, but it did it in a field rather than a housing estate, a lot of fishing line and a lead did not find the bottom of it when it had stopped flowing Shocked
Ty Gwyn

This one is down around 350ft to the nearest working seam according to the plans.
dpack

plugging the thing might be a bit difficult, random scrap metal and marine set would be my first thought, but it would need a lot

a "lid" may be optimistic if it could go sideways

very bad luck for the folk who live there.
Ty Gwyn

Latest info on this shaft is was abandoned 1881,shaft down roughly 350ft to seam,then workings rising under the mountain,no info regarding extent of workings,so maybe no definite plans,but with possibility of far extent of workings being at a higher OD than the surface of shaft could explain the force of water exiting.
Having been in old workings with oxidisation,the inside of them homes are in one hell of a mess,it would be like getting into a bath of tomato soup with ones cloths on.
Mistress Rose

Nasty. At least here ground water tends to be clean. We drink it out of the taps.
dpack

",it would be like getting into a bath of tomato soup "

i dont think i would trust you in the kitchen Rolling Eyes Laughing

fe2+, fe3+, assorted organics some of which are quite nasty, probably various oxidation states of sulphur, probably significant traces of metals, perhaps a few traces of radio active things and whatever pH that mix gives

tomato soup, even from a can, would be a delight a few feet deep in the house compared to that sort of mix

a different and deliberate drainage one down by the old (derelict) canal near barnsley jets vertically from an open bore pipe, it is oddly clean looking but smells like a volcano and kills the vegetation Rolling Eyes

unless it can be blocked or diverted those houses might be history not homes

in better mine news some chinese fellas have been extracted after a couple of extra weeks on shift and the wrong side of a collapse, half are still missing but at least some are safe.

rescued

i have only once been the wrong side of a big chunk of stone, it was deliberate as there seemed no other way to remove it in a rather tight pinch point of a wormhole
it was planned, my chums had explicit instructions including pumping air to me if it took too long to break it up for removal but in a small chamber with several hundred kilos of gritstone between me and the vertical exit was a little tense Rolling Eyes
ER are lightweights so far, lock on is one thing, that stuff is hardcore

deliberately getting "stuck" underground and intending to "passively" resist rescue can be a bit interesting at times Shocked
Slim

Someone forgot to turn off the chocolate milk spigot?
Mistress Rose

Any further news on that Ty Gwyn? It is going to take some sorting out by the looks of it.
Ty Gwyn

Nothing much on the news,except the water flow has eased and the colouring has virtually cleared showing the bulk of water has exited and now its the old workings draining.
An older map i`ve seen puts this old shaft at a higher position than the BGS shows,thus shows they worked a higher seam the Upper Maesmelyn/Swansea 2ft seam at 60ft from surface as well as the lower seam at a greater depth,but its this higher seam i would imagine has caused the problem as to the right of these workings is a major fault also near enough on the line of the fault is a brook coming down the valley giving the possibility of the workings breaching the brook,whether at the time of working or over the years since,so more possibilities to investigate.
dpack

9 dead. 1 still missing

any rescued was good.
Slim

Yikes, so that wasn't just a gradual emergence.

I know you've got layers of history built on layers of history, but the possibility of old mine shafts causing havoc in a populated area is a little hard for me to get my head wrapped around.
dpack

in my home town in west yorks the college relocated, selling the site has been rather difficult as 70ft under it is a large water filled chamber from an unmapped mine C1795-1805 that was abandoned due to water

it is not considered a mining town but has a few near surface and valley side drift seams that were exploited pre 1820 or so, maybe 200 drifts and pits, the coal is not good for engine use so became useless by then and few are properly mapped and recorded
Slim

Old wells are sometimes encountered in the woods here, and old cellar holes, but mines are faiy rare (and often known about)
Ty Gwyn

The 9 dead was in the Chinese Gold mine collapse Slim.
dpack

The 9 dead was in the Chinese Gold mine collapse Slim.
from the little i know of it , the bang man did his bit to loosen some rock but something bad happened with 20 or so folk the wrong side of the way out

perhaps a bit like the unfortunate chaps in wales a few years ago, full of unexpected water has had mentions as well as blocked in

holes are dangeroos, legacy holes even more so.

ty is the expert but i have needed to learn a few things about holes

re old ones, i used to spend a fair bit of time in penwith, more holes than a swiss cheese
3 of us were having a nice picnic in a pretty but slightly moody place, there was a rumble and with no visible cracking on the surface we ended up about 10 feet closer to the sea ,
later we found that a large hole with a 4 second rock drop to the splash had opened up a couple of hundred yards along the clifftop slope
that was a bit lucky and educational, old mineral mines are interesting
Ty Gwyn

The Chinese gold mine was a shaft mine working on different levels,bad geology can cause big falls,safety in chinese mines is rather lapse to what is in the UK.

There was nothing unexpected about the water in the Gleision Colliery,it was marked on the plans with a 37m cautionary barrier,no precautionary procedure was in place to drive through and no permission given by mines inspectorate,
The outcome was a big cover up.
dpack

umm, known, ignored and later hidden is bad

a drop shaft and multi level workings as seemingly in the china tragedy would seem to have built in h and s issues

if we had needed to continue i was heading for a quarry face as a "emergency exit" as we wormed and chambered for living and storage space, down and secure is fine but a back door made sense

in some ways holes are comfortably "safe", in others they can be well nasty

had we needed to continue i recon i had about 50 ft to go sideways from the lowest "chamber" to get to the face(i was going to get close with a tiny hole [air could be useful as well] that could be enlarged quickly if needs be)
the top was hard, with lots of metal and concrete and obstacles physical and human to eviction, but emergency exit was in the plan , even if it needed stealth

an obstructional intent in gritstone with sandstone/sandy bits and fractures is pretty safe compared to hunting coal or minerals for a living

any occupied hole should have at least 2 doors imho, two drops and work between them is a good plan for any mining, money makes that tricky

the gleison thing of ignoring the water out of the "break through " drilling was very wrong, i am an amateur but would not have popped that wall even without the benefit of maps etc that showed where it might be coming from
Ty Gwyn

the gleison thing of ignoring the water out of the "break through " drilling was very wrong,

If permission had been given by the inspectorate drilling was the correct procedure,advance boring in a fan as one advanced through the cautionary barrier,when one contacts water through this procedure,one knows the distance from the water.
Every thing that happened before this incident was totally wrong,management side and i hate to say workmen side,it was just not what one does in them circumstances.
Mistress Rose

I know there were a lot of questions asked at the time, but it seemed to fade from the news Ty Gwyn. Thank goodness mine safety in the UK, and lack of mines, makes that rare.

Slim, the UK is a small country with lots of people. A lot of towns owe their existence to mines, ports and similar, so there are now a lot of ways the old reasons can come and bite them. For instance, salt has been extracted at a number of towns ending in 'wich' since at least Saxon times; over 1000 years ago, and one at least has serious subsidence because of it. In our woods we have the remains of Bronze Age fields and burial mounds, Saxon boundary ditches and banks and WWII dug outs. This history dates back over 3000 years, and is within about a mile of a village of several thousand people. We always tell anyone cutting in the woods that there is archaeology in every part and to familiarise themselves with it before they trip over it or fall down it.
Nick

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55817039
dpack

lots of fe3+ in the photos

very nasty
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