| Archive for Downsizer For an ethical approach to consumption |
| cab |
Community GardenHeres the situation.Nasty shrubbery in front of my house; just on the other side of the pavement to my front garden (those reading these pages for long enough will recall how that garden has been a constant source of joy for me, what with the council mistaking it for theirs and levelling it and Virgin media not understanding the meaning of trespass... but I digress). Now, said shrubby bit is compacted, dying off, ripped apart by kids... Its got to go. Its a state, its a real eyesore, and the local sprogs don't value it so its become where they throw broken toys and flytipped crap they find that they play with and break. I firmly believe that if kids grow up in an environment in which there is little to value, then they will not learn to value their environment. Thats got to change. So I raised the idea of turning it into a garden with the local council workers who are responsible for it, and provisionally if I can raise the money from somewhere (and there are presumably sources within the council, I'm following a couple of them up) then they'd help by rotivating, hopefull supplying fresh toposoil, and putting a fence up. I just talked to a whole bunch of neighbourhood kids yesterday, and once they'd got over the fact that an adult was talking to them and not telling them off, they're all up for it. I mean, as up for it as kids aged 4-11 are going to be, I expect that everything would be intermittently overwatered and that weeding would be overenthusiastic, but hey-ho, thats how it is. They want to grow apples, beanstalks, plums, corn on the cob, flowers and bananas (the banana child is just shy of 5 years old, so hasn't really grasped the finer points of tropical plant cultivation yet...). Now this is key; its the bairns out there playing, making a racket (as they're meant to do!) and I need their good will and involvement. Going to natter about this to the council bods again now I know that most of the neighbours (at least all of the ones I've talked to) are in favour. Any advice? The front court is enclosed (houses on four sides, two alleys), although theres light for most of the day on that patch. Our house shades it for half of the morning, doesn't get late evening light, so you could grow most things there. When (if) I get the go-ahead for this I can supply plenty of seeds myself, I've always got spare, and I totally plan to beg seeds and plantlets from other Downsizer members. |
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| mochyn |
Have a go: it's an excellent plan, but I suspect what you'll need most of is patience! | ||||
| Fee |
No advice, but it sounds like a great idea!
We have a similar scrap of land next to our house, but the kids here are a bit older (13+). They chop the daffs I put in down most years, just for the hell of it, don't take the flowers home or anything, so I dread to think what they'd do a garden 
I suppose if it's theirs it's a different matter, though. Good luck, and I'm sure I'll have some spare seeds for you next year 
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| cab |
Thats the biggie really. I want to give them ownership, I'm hoping to guide them and I'll happily do much of the work (ain't a major endeavour), but the aim is to make it theirs, give them some pride and some joy in it. Cheers for the kind thoughts guys
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| Mrs Fiddlesticks |
might be an idea to get the parents if not involved but at least aware of your plans. That way they won't be suspicious about you working with their darlings ( its a shame we live in that sort of world but there are a lot of Daily Mail readers out there....) and will know that it is intended to be a nice bit of ground so may be less likely to condone kids negative behaviour to the area | ||||
| cab |
Yes, I've talked to some of them already, and no objections yet, although its easier talking to the kids; all I have to do is go outside of the front door and I seem to be surrounded. Its funny, I don't especially like children or cats, but they always seem to love me. |
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| JB |
You can probably also expect lots of hassle and interference from jobsworths demanding H&S qualifications, certified first aiders and CRB checks for everyone who might drive within two miles of the site. The kids will be the least problem, in fact I would expect them to be the most helpful people you will encounter.
On the positive side I would expect them to be fully up for it, particularly if they are asked not told, the only way you might have "kid problems" would be from those who are not involved in the project (NB all the above is second hand musings based on Mrs JB's experience of running a summer school - there's a world of difference between the attitude in term when they're told to do something and out of term when they volunteer to do exactly the same) |
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| marigold |
Great idea cab  . If you are going to grow mainly summer crops it might be worth considering what to do with the bare bits of the plot in winter? Maybe "plant" cardboard flowers on sticks made by the kids (school might help with that).
And what about organising events for the winter months e.g. bulb-planting in October, clear-up bonfire in November, tree dressing in December, clear-up ready for spring in January (with a bonfire of tatty old decorations), and so on, to maintain interest? You might be able to rope in other residents to do things even if they aren't interested in gardening, e.g. arty person to run the tree-dressing, camera-mad dad to take photos/video, Mums to organise picnics etc. |
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| JB |
How large an area are we talking about here? Would it be large enough to divide into areas, sort of; here's a picnic area, heres a wildlife border; here's a veg patch etc. | ||||
| Mrs Fiddlesticks |
for a short while I helped run a school gardening club. They just loved harvesting spuds - like finding buried treasure!
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| cab |
Gosh... Lots of thoughts there already, cheers guys
Not a huge area, just paced it out, 12 paces by 10 paces to begin with, possibly a little longer, enough for a little garden divided into four areas I think. I love the idea of cardboard/winter flower 
Most of the houses here are council, some are ex-council, turns out that the council are up for it but now need to more formally consult the residents; letters are being sent out. |
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| cab |
Oh, and regarding safety/insurance, I thought I'd enquire to see what coverage the local council have for that. | ||||
| cab |
I have a cunning plan to grow a small patch of 'highland burgundy' and 'salad blue'. Like little coloured gem stones
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| Azura Skye |
wow - I'm thinking of doing the same thing! Isn't it funny how you see much more of what you're thinking about?
I had the idea a few days ago, talking to someone about local kids and how they would (possibly) respect something a little more if it was THEIRS and they could do what they wanted with it. I'm so glad someone else is thinking along the same lines... I did some research and I found the federation of city farms and community gardens was a nice webbie. It offers HOW TO's on lots of issues, inc planning and health and safety. http://www.farmgarden.org.uk/ I also found some inspirational community garden sites, I especially like this one from the Culpeper Garden in Islington http://www.culpeper.org.uk/ I got the beginning of the idea whilst reading the book SLOW IS BEAUTIFUL by Cecile Andrews and she really supports the idea of community - her writing is influencial : ) I found the SLOW MOVEMENT website shortly after, which also has info on Community Gardens which I found just after thinking of having one in the village. I then went on to get the book TRANSITION HANDBOOK by Rob Hoskins, which describes in detail how to create a community for post-oil living.... anyways Cab - I think the idea is great. I've had a lot of feedback - mostly people say, I don't think anyone will care about it. And kids will ruin it. But the idea is that it could get vandalised, but so what? At the moment the site is a junky scrub land with bits of concrete on it. Hopefully the council will let something be done to it... |
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| cab |
And if it doesn't work, if it gets vandalised and we have to do something different with the land, then at least we've tried. Less to be lost in trying than not trying, I think
Thanks for the links, great info in there. |
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| wellington womble |
Even if it does get vandalised, most of the kids that are involved will learn a very valuable, if hard, lesson about how to treat other people's property. | ||||
| Behemoth |
Kids always seem to enjoy a 'tallest sunflower' competition. | ||||
| Azura Skye |
kids like ponds too, and I've seen ponds at community gardens so hopefully it wont be ruled out in health n safety.
I agree cab, better to try than do nowt
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| JB |
I thought about ponds but would rule it out unless you can seal it off or ensure that no kids have unsupervised access (CAB did mention some kids as young as five). That wouldn't necessarily rule out water features of some kind though. |
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| cab |
They're younger than that, some of 'em. A couple are pre-schoolers. |
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| cab |
Google Earth is a marvellous thing. I've just measured the area using it, obviously I need to do the same with a tape measure to be sure, but its about 6.3m across, 8-9.5m long (its a slightly irregular shape). Not vast, but big enough to liven up the court. Theres an identical shaped bit of tarmac pavement on the other side of the path in the square, mirroring this area, so plenty of sitting out space or organising space there already.
Letters are going out to residents to see if they object. |
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| Mrs Fiddlesticks |
there may well be grants available to offset costs - worth looking around. We've applied to and got a few little pockets of money from some diverse organisations to part fund our community woodland project.
For example we belong to http://www.cagoxfordshire.org.uk/ which is a directory of Community Action groups. I guess you don't want to do anything that formal but its a thought |
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| cab |
No, thats a great idea. I've talked to one local body that gives grants for small projects that reduce petty crime, and they're quite positive about this. I'm waiting to see what the local council will fund directly first, see whether we need any more readies... Oh, and I'm also hoping that when asked, the rest of the locals don't hate the idea. |
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| hamster |
That's a fantastic idea, Cab, good luck. There have been mutterings of doing something similar here, and I did find some quite good links on starting a community garden. I don't have time to trawl the internet for them now, but I will try and dig them out later on. | ||||
| Mrs Fiddlesticks |
we've had grants from parish council, Woodland trust and this lot - http://www.restoreuk.org/
plus our local district council were also helpful http://tinyurl.com/5q33ab |
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| alison |
I am sure I have read some seed companies give school projects free seeds.
Maybe worth contacting some. |
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| cab |
I'll look at that for sure; I've also got my eye on some local plant nurseries who are likely to be helpful. |
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| cab |
After some badgering, the nice lady at the council has got letters out asking for people to say yes or no... And I've got support from the people who plant trees for and do other planting for the council (including a nice chap who has been known to fit many a vegetable plant into the formal beds for the city council).
So all I need now is for the rest of the residents not to be opposed. Volounteers to help would be nice, adults as well as the assorted school kids who have already offered of course. |
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| Belinda |
The Community Garden in my town has had some support from Groundworks and also from the Countryside Management Service - might be worth investigating? | ||||
| cab |
Can't hurt. I'll go look. Ta. | ||||
| Helen M |
i have found kids like plants that do "stuff" a senses garden. flowere that follow the sun and close at night. sunflowers and asters? and there is always sensitive plant. it curls up when you touch it. and nice squishy thyme. can be stood on and just springs back. and smells nice too. borage is also a favorite of my wee two. as it is pretty bright and compleatly edible | ||||
| cab |
I think that a sunflower contest is mandatory
All of the kids thus far asked want to grow apples (or, strictly speaking, when told that bananas and oranges aren't practical they want to grow apples). After that comes 'flowers', beanstalks (not beans, you understand), roses, lettuce, etc. And one of the most useful things I think can be done for adults around the square, to keep 'em all on side, is to create a herb bed; bay, rosemary, thyme, mint in buckets, southernwood, etc. Perennials that are low maintenance (or low-ish maintenance), smell good, and if people want a sprig or five, fine. Got about a week or so to wait for responses from other residents, then the orders go in for trees with the council (have to oblige the kids with apple trees!), and then providing the natives are not restless the begging for input from assorted local organisations (nurseries, fruit farms, seed merchants, etc.) starts. Edit: And yes, borage is a must. This is Cambridge you know, one has to have borage in ones Pimms. |
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| Helen M |
i will be planting up some sensitive plant soon. i have always kept it indoors but have been informed that i will do well in a sunny spot outside. if it all goes well do you want some? | ||||
| cab |
If you have an excess, I can see there being a good spot for. Ta
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| cab |
We are 'go' with the community garden
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| mochyn |
Excellent! I was talking to someone in Conwy yesterday about their community orchard. Wonderful ideas, both! |
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| marigold |
Great! Are you going to show us before and after pics? | ||||
| cab |
Will do, although I'm toying with how precisely to best do that. Perhaps with a livejournal blog, I dunno. |
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| marigold |
Well worth keeping a record, however you decide to do it .
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