2steps
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Demi john helpI have a demi john I want to use but what do I need to seal it?
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N.V.M.
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how about a rubber "cork" from your local homebrew supply shop?
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nature's child
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If you're going to use it for fermentation, then yes a rubber cork is okay but you need the air lock to go with it. This allows the gas from the fermentation to escape and the water inside the air lock stops any nasties getting in and turning the liquid to something that resembles vinegar. Not an expert at this only started making wine this summer but this works for me.
Denise
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jema
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| N.V.M. wrote: | | how about a rubber "cork" from your local homebrew supply shop? |
To echo this. I have seen in old wine making books diagrams of all sorts of ingenious home made air locks. But when a bored bung and a big "bubbler" costs abotu £1.50 and in reusable foreever, I say don't economise. A good air lock will help show you more clearly your wines fermentation progress.
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Lozzie
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Do you prefer plastic airlock or glass? Or are they much of a muchness to you?
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jema
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| Lozzie wrote: | | Do you prefer plastic airlock or glass? Or are they much of a muchness to you? |
Plastic anyday. I think unless you want to be what I would consider unreasonably green, then plastic has the enormous advantage of being unbreakable.
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dougal
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I think that 'bubbler' airlocks used to be rather expensive items... but no more.
Would preferences among airlocks be mainly determined by maximum gas flowrate and minimum topping up? (Quite apart from fragility, cost...)
Are there any particularly good or bad designs?
As a winemaking novice, my understanding was that when the fermentation phase was finished, that the last of the yeast should be killed with a spot of sulphite, and the wine 'racked off' into another demijohn, given an unbored *plain* bung, and left to clear and/or mature for... ooh... ages.
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2steps
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thank you
this will be my first wine. now I know the name of what I'm looking for I will see if there's a shop in town I can get one
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Caplan
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And always be careful about the initial yeast action if you really want to start a wine in a demijohn. Leave plenty of room to prevent it bubbling up and out of the air lock! A campden tablet solution in the airlock (instead of just water) with a bit of cotton wool/tissue pushed gently in the top is an extra belt and braces measure against the fruit flies!
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N.V.M.
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over here(Canada) we call demi johns "carboys" btw...
is the term used there at all?
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jema
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| N.V.M. wrote: | over here(Canada) we call demi johns "carboys" btw...
is the term used there at all? |
It is certainly used in wine making books. whether anyone uses it in conversation though, i don''t know?
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sean
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I think it would be regarded as archaic in conversation.
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sally_in_wales
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I always understood a carboy to be one of those onion shaped bottles- but maybe thats my misinterpretation? You do see pictures of them in winemakingbooks, often the older ones listed as an alternative to demijohns
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jema
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I wonder if anyone uses them? I have seen pictures and evn ebay sales of 5 gallon glass carboys and some wine makers insist without evidence that I have seen that glass is better than plastic. But to my mind, the sheer weight and fragility of them would rule them out. I can lift my 5 gallon plastic fermenters up and down stairs easily, but glass would be a two person job.
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Silas
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Carboys used to be very common, they usually come with a wicker or wire 'cage. They were used to suppy garages with distilled water and battery acid ( among other things and are ideall for wine making as they clean betterthan plastic and do not hold residuial smells.
They are heavy, but surprisingly tough.
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sally_in_wales
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Bet the ones with the wicker cage would be lovely for bulk maturing wine. You'd need a big storage area though I suppose
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dougal
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I note that Wikipedia thinks that Carboy is the general term for a big glass bottle and that "demijohn" refers specifically to a "!5 gallon" {US} capacity vessel... (interesting derivation though)
"Two nations divided by a common language" 
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cab
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Yeah, Americans always refer to them as carboys, and although Wiki might tell you otherwise they tend to call the big ones 5 gallon carboys.
I'd have brought two five gallon containers back from a tip a while ago, but she wouldn't let me  They had removable plastic covers for protection.
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gil
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| dougal wrote: |
As a winemaking novice, my understanding was that when the fermentation phase was finished, that the last of the yeast should be killed with a spot of sulphite, and the wine 'racked off' into another demijohn, given an unbored *plain* bung, and left to clear and/or mature for... ooh... ages. |
that's what I thought.   I've found I never use my plain bungs, because the wines just keep on fermenting and fermenting, even when their SG is verging on 990, and I still have to keep them under airlock. Even sulphite sometimes seems ineffective for stopping this ferment. So I'm facing a demijohn and airlock/bored bung shortage as autumn approaches. Have resorted to putting demijohns in the fridge for a week to kill remaining yeast before bottling. also some hastily bottled birch sap wine, done in order to free up a demijohn.
how to stop fermentation ????
and conversely, how to make it continue through down to 990 or thereabouts ? I have Damson 2003, which is still fermenting slowly but significantly (you wouldn't want to bottle it), and its SG is still about 1030. many attempts to restart fermentation, including the latest with new wine yeast starter, adding a tiny bit of wine at a time; then sultanas in desperation (nutrient), and in a warm place. Last resort will be to siphon some of the very active sediment out of blackcurrant (whose SG is about 1000) and add to small amount of recalcitrant damnson.
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sean
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SG is a measure of density, 1000 being water. The SG of alcohol is lower than 1000 (don't know of the top of my head what it is), so there's no reason for the SG of wine not to drop below 1000.
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cab
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| gbst wrote: |
how to stop fermentation ????
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Rack it off the sediment, add a campden tablet. And repeat. And add a slug of vodka if you really want, boost the alcohol content to a point where the yeast dies.
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and conversely, how to make it continue through down to 990 or thereabouts ? I have Damson 2003, which is still fermenting slowly but significantly (you wouldn't want to bottle it), and its SG is still about 1030. many attempts to restart fermentation, including the latest with new wine yeast starter, adding a tiny bit of wine at a time; then sultanas in desperation (nutrient), and in a warm place. Last resort will be to siphon some of the very active sediment out of blackcurrant (whose SG is about 1000) and add to small amount of recalcitrant damnson. |
Sounds like you've got a sweet, high-ish alcohol wine there. A tough environment for yeast to get established. You want a tough old yeast to get that one going again; might I suggest investing in a high alcohol yeast, something like a champagne yeast, activating it and adding that with a little yeast nutrient?
How much sugar did you add at the start, and how much fruit?
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gil
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as I understand it, fermentation stops when the level of alcohol is sufficient to kill the yeast. and for different kinds of yeast (brewers, bakers, wine) this level is different. So for example, brewers yeast dies at a lower alcohol level than wine, which I assume is why beer is not as strong as wine. normally wine yeast-based wine will be considered 'fermented out' at about 990 (that's when it dies).
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cab
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| gbst wrote: | | as I understand it, fermentation stops when the level of alcohol is sufficient to kill the yeast. and for different kinds of yeast (brewers, bakers, wine) this level is different. So for example, brewers yeast dies at a lower alcohol level than wine, which I assume is why beer is not as strong as wine. normally wine yeast-based wine will be considered 'fermented out' at about 990 (that's when it dies). |
You're kind of right. All yeast has its limit, and that limit depends on the strain, but 'fermented out' is a combination of too much alcohol and insufficient sugar, it's an equilibrium point. A lot of dry wines will get going again if you add more sugar, if there isn't enough alcohol present. A gravity of 990 can indeed mean that it's fermented out, but probably not if the starting gravity wasn't high enough to begin with.
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