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Tavascarow

Government try to gag experts.

UK government gags advisers in bees and pesticides row.
dpack

no change there then.

never let truth get in the way of power
Mistress Rose

I have sympathy with the farmers, but if there are not bees to pollinate the OSR, it will have an even lower yield.
Tavascarow

Limited success but not the result we wanted.
If you haven't signed the petitions floating around please do.
The pressure still needs to be applied to stop Liz Truss expanding this next year.
They have ignored large amounts of peer reviewed science, their own scientific advisors & the EU.
David Cameron 2010.
Quote:
"I want this to be the greenest government ever."

As far as I'm concerned they are not a party of the people or a party for the aspirational but the party of big business.
Calling them consevatives when they have/are opened/opening the environment, our woodland, SSSI's & national parks & greenbelts to abuse & development is as far from conservation as you can get.
I submit they are renamed the PPP.
Profit over People Party. (full of ****).
Hairyloon

I submit they are renamed the PPP.
Profit over People Party. (full of ****).

"PPP" is already an overused acronym, how about:
Profit Above People Party.
Profit Over Ordinary People
Party of Usury and Komplete Excess

Sorry, it's late and I am not firing on all cylinders... and I was never much good at acronyms at the best of times.
Mistress Rose

I did sign the petition, and so did husband. I don't suppose they will listen to us any more than their scientific advisers, but I suppose if they realise that a lot of people are against lifting the ban, they might be a little more careful in limiting where and how neonics can be used.
Tavascarow

I did sign the petition, and so did husband. I don't suppose they will listen to us any more than their scientific advisers, but I suppose if they realise that a lot of people are against lifting the ban, they might be a little more careful in limiting where and how neonics can be used.
I'm sure you are right.
The most worrying thing to me now is TTIP because if that goes through, regardless of what a government think or want, corporations like Monsanto will be allowed to sue them for loss of trade. It will be the final act of 'selling England by the pound' to plagiarise a song title.
& our government are supporters of it. Not a surprise to me, but people need to know how much they are giving away.

Hairyloon I like all your choices perhaps we should have a democratic vote?
Whichever one gets 25% is the peoples choice. Wink
Mistress Rose

I have got letters back from the various MEPs that represent this area, and all but the Green MEP thinks that they can word the treaty so that big corporations can't do that. They think that other treaties have been badly worded. What they don't seem to understand is that some big business is bigger than the EU, and that the government and EUs record of getting wording right so that there is no way a very clever lawyer can wriggle though the gaps is so poor that it would be laughable in other circumstances. Tavascarow

The question I ask is how does it benefit the UK & the EU.
We already have wide open free trade agreements.
& if it's so beneficial, why all the secret behind closed doors meetings?
Big business has been driving American politics for longer & with more influence than it has here. & I really can't see this as more than the likes of Monsanto, who already have a toe hold with Syngenta (now a Monsanto subsidiary, & neonic manufacurer) bullying their way into Europe.
Mistress Rose

I am inclined to agree with you Tavascarow. Sadly, the politicians see it as a way of opening up trade. They think they can stop poor quality things coming in, big business calling the tune etc. by a properly written treaty. I am afraid I don't think they will be able to, and that some politicians won't want to.

My experience of American business is that they wouldn't know quality control/assurance if it bit them in the face, and that their tactics can be very underhand. I am sure there are plenty of very ethical American businesses, but the ones I have come across have been rather lacking.
Tavascarow

This Trade Deal Could Be Bad News for Anyone Who Lives in Europe and Likes Food.


38 degrees campaign.
Mistress Rose

I have signed the petitions and the e-mails I sent to the MEPs were part of that campaign. Hope the powers that be will realise that they do have to face the electorate at some point, and that these campaigns are not just nuisance but real people rather upset about things.

Suppose it is better than the French way where they disrupt transport systems badly and burn things in the streets. Lets hope it has at least if not more effect.
Hairyloon

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/104796

ETA 200 signatures in the time it took me to confirm my email address...

30156.
dpack

39872

im lucky to live in a city in some ways,at least the bees who eat my nectar and pollinate my brambles and beans etc etc are urban and most urban folk dont use much worse than flea splosh on the dog or ant powder for the nasty wee bitey ones we have round here.
Tavascarow

Oilseed rape yield higher without neonics.
Quote:
Matt Shardlow, Buglife's CEO, added: "This is further evidence that neonicotinoids are not essential to maintaining crop yields. While some farmers struggled to establish their oilseed rape crop because the weather last year was ideal for flea beetles, where they have persisted the results have been good."

He adds that the very reason for the improved harvest of oilseed rape - an insect-pollinated crop that provides a rich source of nectar for bees - may be the neonic ban itself, permitting larger and healthier populations of bees and other pollinators:

"We seem to have forgotten that bees and other pollinators are essential to good crop yields. In the trade off this year pollinators may have had a bigger positive effect than any negative impact of flea beetles."
Mistress Rose

Interesting article. If the yields are up it makes sense to continue the ban to see if they remain high. One years results are not conclusive, but several years above average are likely to be a very strong indicator that other ways of reducing flea beetle, such as crop rotation might be a lot better. Tavascarow

I agree, one years result isn't conclusive.
But I smell a rat because the ban was lifted a week ago, just prior to this being announced?
Bayer, Syngenta, the NFU & Ms Elizabeth Truss saw this coming (or stalled it) & thought they'd better act fast.
As I've said before this has got very little to do with what farmers want & more to do with industry profit.
Screw the environment, as long as there's cheap food on the supermarket shelves people wont really care.
Mistress Rose

Some people do care, like us. There are few petitions going the rounds and altogether a fairly significant part of the population will be seeing them, and hopefully signing them. Lets hope this is one of the subjects on which people power has an effect.
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