| Archive for Downsizer For an ethical approach to consumption |
| tahir |
Keeping sheepNo idea on livestock at all but there's a decent halal abbatoir 16 miles away and Rich the tractor keeps cattle so I'll have someone to talk to if I need to so how easy is it?I need the easiest option available, is it possible to buy young weaned lambs and grow them on yourself? |
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| Rob R |
Re: Keeping sheep
Sounds like the easiest opton- no breeding, or shearing (if killed up to 14 months) 
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| tahir |
Re: Keeping sheep
So what's the time of year to start then? |
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| Rob R |
There'll be weaned lambs to be had from now until July time ish | ||||
| tahir |
Hmm, I'll talk to Rich then |
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| tahir |
I've got a 3 acre field that I might use for 'em, how many could graze it, and would Novemberish be a good time to take 'em to the abbatoir? | ||||
| tahir |
And what about breed? Will they all be fairly easy with no breeding/shearing? | ||||
| dpack |
nice one .
bahhh . electric fence (you know i think electric fence is good but it is  )
sheep muck is ace in the veg compost but not if they drop it off themselves 
food is a good bribe to make sheep go places but they are quite willful at times , not too often , it depends on the breed and are they still boys . they taste good
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| tahir |
What are shearlings? I've seen ads for shearlings of Texel and Lleyn so far. | ||||
| tahir |
And will they need feeds? I don't really want to get into buying feeds in... | ||||
| Beckyess |
try Sheep for Beginners Good Luck!
Becky |
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| tahir |
Nice. I'd love to go on a course but no time at the mo. I'm lucky in that the lady next door's son (the tractor man) keeps some cattle and all his equipment on her land, so he's there at least twice a day. I'll be able to call on him for help if necessary, just wondered in a general way how easy it was going to be really. | ||||
| Gervase |
If you're just rearing weaned store lambs to fatten for a few months of the year and don't want to buy in feed, you should be OK with a density of three to the acre on good grass - so your three acres gives you nine sheep.
Depending on the breed, it's unlikely that they'll need shearing. It's a fairly low-maintenance project, and there's no reason why it shouldn't work well. The alternative would be to rent out your three acres to someone with sheep in exchange for a lamb or two. A piece of land like that is invaluable to someone who needs to rest a some of their own pasture for a while, and the result would be that you get the grass down and some meat with absolutely zero input, as the sheep owner has to sort out fencing and security (which ain't cheap. A three-strand reel-based electric fencing kit, with posts and energiser would set you back at least £250 new). It doesn't get any easier than that! |
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| tahir |
Now that Mr G sounds ideal, I'll ask around.. |
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| Treacodactyl |
Do you need to dip lambs at all, especially if kept to 14 months? What about looking after their feet and trimming up their bottoms? Are any breeds much easier to look after and less likely to suffer problems than others? | ||||
| Rob R |
You don't need to dip sheep at all these days- compulsory dipping is again no longer in place, though there are calls for it up in Scotland & other areas where sheep scab is becoming a problem. The only parasites Tahir would need to look out for during these months are blowfly, though a cypermethrin spot-on product would cover them, and Barrier do a good product for the organic sheep keeper. The other main thing is good hygiene- flies won't strike dry wool, so they'll hunt out the wounded or dirty sheep. Shorter tailed breeds (not that the breeds tail are any shorter, but different breeders will dock tails to a lesser or greater extent, Texels may have just a stump, some of the hill breeds will have a 3/4 tail left intact) are less likely to get struck. If he can, he should go for a Native British breed, as most British continental breeds have been bred up & fed up much like the commercial pigs- ie they lay down something, quickly, wether it is worthy of the term 'meat' is another matter. Ideally, in terms of taste, a Jacob or Kerry will be about top, but if you are getting someone in, you are more likely to get a commercial cross or pure breed, and the best ones to look for will be the lleyn, suffolk, mule, half bred, etc. The native breeds/crosses produce a better carcass in their native country. |
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| Joey |
http://www.nationalsheep.org.uk/education/Chapter_11.pdf
See above for explanation of sheep terminology with regional variations. |
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| Treacodactyl |
Thanks for the comments Rob, it's been 20 years  since I helped out on a sheep farm and that was just a bit help of lambing and herding.
Does anyone know how much would you expect to pay for lambs and what would they cost to be slaughtered and butchered ready for collection? |
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| Louisdog |
Not sure on the cost of lambs - I think a lot depends on the breed. Shetlands may be around £20 each I think.
Killing costs £9 and cutting £3 around here, we are in West Wales. Make sure you have enough freezer space for all the meat if you get 9! 
Cheers |
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| Rob R |
That sounds about right £20-30 and killing & butchering must be cheap in West Wales- £13 or £14 here (lambs & hoggs respectively). |
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| mochyn |
Don't forget there are 100 diseases of sheep and the first sign of 99 of them is death
Not really, but there are lots of things to which they can fall prey. |
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| Louisdog |
Hi Mochyn I think you're right - we have a horrible book of sheep diseases and when you anxiously read the 'symptoms' section so you can know what early warning signs to look out for, the first clinical sign is often 'death' !
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| tahir |
Hmm, all of a sudden it seems like a really bad idea |
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| mochyn |
Noooo, Tahir: never let it be said I put anyone off an interesting project! Especially an edible one...
All you need is a sheep mentor. I don't mean you should start being guided by what the sheep tell you, but find someone who has experience in sheep keeping and get e few books on the subject. Is there a smallholders' club near you? Or look in Country Smallholding for breeders or rare breeds enthusiasts in your area. Go on: you know you want to. Ah, go on, go on, go on, go on, go on... |
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| tahir |
Jonnyboy says he does whatever the sheep tell him, he says it was them that told him the trick with the wellies... |
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| tahir |
Not that I know of, but like I say the lady next door's son has cattle on her land, he also does all my tractory bits so he's around every day, he'll be able to help me. I'm talking to him this week about it. |
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| Rob R |
Clostridial diseases are the most common ones that produce sudden death, and the seven most common are easily prevented with a single vaccine, so if you do buy lambs in, just check that they have had an initial & booster dose of Heptavac or Ovivac. If you need any technical info on the subject, just ask- I have a few very heavy books on the subject 
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| Anna-marie |
Hi Tahir,
Don't forget that you will need to check that movement forms have been completed for them being transported to you. I assume that you have a CPH number? If not, contact your local DEFRA office for advice on how to obtain one. You will also need a medicine chart to record all medications given, including vaccinations, worming, de-lousing, etc. Their feet need to be checked and trimmed approximately monthly, in order to prevent foot-rot. The best management system for this is vaccination with foot-vax, trimming, and spraying with a tetramycine spray. Also, when the sheep arrive, you will have to tag them with an "S" tag. I know it sounds like a lot of fuss, but your local State Veterinary Service will be able to help. There are loads of free booklets that are really helpful, and the British Wool Marketing Board hold excellent one-day courses to cover issues such as hoof-trimming, dagging, etc. I bought five ewes and a ram last year (the first time that I have kept sheep), primarily to spin their coloured fleeces, and I have enjoyed every minute of it. Most of them answer to their names, and they are all friendly, and like to be stroked. I now have seven lambs from four of the ewes (with the last one due to lamb any day) and they are delightful. One of them is piebald, and looks like a friesian calf on a photo that I took of him!! I think the price that you would expect to pay probably depends on their weight at the time of purchase. I hope that some of this helps, and that I have not put you off!! Have fun!! Anna-marie |
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| tahir |
Thanks Ann-marie, lots of good advice there. | ||||
| Rob R |
And I'll just add that there are alternatives to teramycin if you're bothered about antibiotic overuse and if you want to know more about the efficacy of the footrot vaccine, I'll get in touch with a friend who was involved with the trials for that product.
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| Treacodactyl |
Going back to prices for lambs for a moment, someone was telling me the other day that prices for lamb meat has risen a fair bit due to people eating less chicken due to bird flu worries. Anyone else heard of that? | ||||
| Lionheart |
CPH numbers are dished out by the RPA - phone them for an application form asap as the process can take a few weeks.
The State Vetinary Service will issue you with a flock number, which you'll also need. You won't be able to move sheep on to your holding until you have both of the above. Cris |
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| alison |
I got my CPH number over the phone in about 10 minutes. The written notification came later.
Your land may already have a number anyway. |
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| Rob R |
I'm 99.9% sure of that too and its not my land
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| Gervase |
Depends where you are - our local animal dept are very laid back (to the point of not having a welsh word with the same urgency as manana). We moved our flock onto the holding, sent off the movement licence with the holding number marked 'to follow' and then waited three months for the hoding and flock numbers to be sent, with the dept saying "no worries, it'll sort itself out in the end". |
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| sean |
Ahh, sounds like 'Devon time'. It'll happen at some point so what are you getting stressed about you neurotic incomer? |