Archive for Downsizer For an ethical approach to consumption
 


       Downsizer Forum Index -> Energy Efficiency and Construction
cassy

Toilet standards

According to the Scottish Building Standards -
Scottish Building Standards wrote:
3.12.2 Waterless closets
If a waterless closet is installed it should be to a safe and hygienic design such as:
a. National Sanitation Foundation Certification to Standard NSF 41:‘wastewater recycling/reuse and water conservation devices'; or
b. NFS International Standard NSF/ANSI 41-1999: ‘non-liquid saturated treatment systems’; or
c. to the conditions of a certification by a notified body .

Although some European countries manufacture waterless closets, they have not as yet been tested to any recognised standard. This does not mean that they are unacceptable, just that care should be taken in their choice to ensure they are both safe and hygienic in use.

For the building warrant, I need to prove that our homemade composting toilet will meet these standards, specifically NSF/ANSI 41-1999.

Before I fork out $100 for 38 pages of the standards, has anyone read a copy of any NSF standards and if so, do they contain enough detail to help me prove that our system will be safe and hygienic?
vegplot

We came across a similar problem for our build on Anglesey. The problem was solved by a letter from the Environment Agency to say they didn't have an issue with composting toilets for domestic dwellings, this was enough to satisfy the local authority.
cassy

Oh, well done! Very Happy

A letter from SEPA was sufficient for our planning permission, but I thought I would have to provide more evidence for building control.
vegplot

Composting toilets are an acceptable way of dealing with human waste.
cassy

Yes, I couldn't agree more.

However, experience has taught me that when you're doing something which is not 'the norm', you need to provide extra information for official bodies in order that they can accept the unusual solution.

Congrats on getting your building regulations approval through. How long did that take?
vegplot

We have got past building regs yet. However, building regs have already said they accept the position on the toilet and took it sitting down. Seriously, they don't have a problem with it.
resistance is fertile

If push comes to shove give Nick or Mark a shout at Elemental solutions they will show you where to go Very Happy
cassy

vegplot wrote:
Seriously, they don't have a problem with it.


That's good to know. Maybe I won't have to provide as much info as I thought. I'm attempting to tie up as many loose ends as I can before we move and I (potentially) have reduced internet access. We're probably going to submit the building warrant next year. Good luck with yours Very Happy .
tahir

I don't know Mark, but Nick at Elemental is a seriously top bloke, he's been soooo useful to us on all sorts of things.
tahir

tahir wrote:
Nick at Elemental is a seriously top bloke


And a director of www.aecb.net an org that all us potential builders should be members of Wink
cassy

tahir wrote:
www.aecb.net an org that all us potential builders should be members of Wink


Already are (since 2006). Very Happy
tahir

Excellent Smile
Treacodactyl

Have you spoken to building control? When I changed my drains building control offered advice before I started and were quite helpful. Also, even though it's stated the drains should be tested to this or that standard he just gave them a quick glance and said the work was fine.
gom

If this is of help to you - taken from my own successful planning application:

a.

Sewage Disposal (Solids) - Composting toilets (also called biological, dry or waterless toilets) are systems that treat human excrement through biological processes, turning it into organic compost material that can be used to fertilise the soil. They are small-scale, complete sewage processing systems not connected to the mains sewage system.

Composting toilets decompose waste by creating the aerobic conditions for bacteria, fungi, worms and other macro and micro-organisms to thrive. The objective is to destroy harmful pathogens, reduce the risk to human health and environment, and transform the waste nutrients into fertile soil. They typically break down waste to 10% of the original volume.
All composting toilets require some form of management to ensure that they remain clean, hygienic and odour free. And all need to have compost material removed at regular intervals. These are minor inconveniences compared to the advantages of composting toilets. They protect groundwater, surface water and soil from sewage pollution, prevent the accumulation of hazardous pathogenic waste, and solve the problem of disposing sewage sludge to landfill. They save huge quantities of water in a world where water is an increasingly scarce resource, and require very little infrastructure. They are low-impact, low-maintenance and can also adapt to any situation, even in places where it is difficult or inappropriate to establish a mains toilet system such as hard rocky soils, high water tables, near springs or in an environmentally sensitive area.

Composting toilets are an excellent example of sustainable design. They provide a safe and effective way to reduce resources and prevent pollution, whilst saving money and energy for the users and the community. At the same time they produce a valuable end-product. Once these benefits are understood, and as the economics of the present extremely wasteful, inefficient and energy intensive water based systems become less and less cost efficient, they are likely to become even more popular.

In a later submission to counter the gross ignorance of objectors, I also pointed out that the University of British Columbia has composting toilets for over 300 staff (if I remember correctly).

I didn't have a problem with the planning authority, but I did have big problems with a whole bunch of gormless 'incomers'. Watch out for them!
cassy

Treacodactyl wrote:
Have you spoken to building control?


Yes, I'll be speaking to the local office, but I'd like to get my facts straight beforehand.
cassy

I'm glad it went through for you gom but sorry to hear about the objectors. Thank you for adding all the details - I'm sure that will be useful to other people when submitting their planning applications.

Did you have to submit further details of the system for building control? That's the stage we're currently at.
resistance is fertile

cassy wrote:
Treacodactyl wrote:
Have you spoken to building control?


Yes, I'll be speaking to the local office, but I'd like to get my facts straight beforehand.


Its always helpful to use an independent DS, such as JHA , rather than the Local Authourity bods as they are working with you rather than 'enforcing' and also tend to be more up to date on such things as private water treatment etc.
vegplot

resistance is fertile wrote:
cassy wrote:
Treacodactyl wrote:
Have you spoken to building control?


Yes, I'll be speaking to the local office, but I'd like to get my facts straight beforehand.


Its always helpful to use an independent DS, such as JHA , rather than the Local Authourity bods as they are working with you rather than 'enforcing' and also tend to be more up to date on such things as private water treatment etc.


I would counter that and say it may be beneficial to educate the local authority so others have an easier time and 'unusual' practices become accepted as standard. It does mean more work for you though.
resistance is fertile

vegplot wrote:
resistance is fertile wrote:
cassy wrote:
Treacodactyl wrote:
Have you spoken to building control?


Yes, I'll be speaking to the local office, but I'd like to get my facts straight beforehand.


Its always helpful to use an independent DS, such as JHA , rather than the Local Authourity bods as they are working with you rather than 'enforcing' and also tend to be more up to date on such things as private water treatment etc.


I would counter that and say it may be beneficial to educate the local authority so others have an easier time and 'unusual' practices become accepted as standard. It does mean more work for you though.


I would agree but with the caveat that you dont spend your time trying to educate them when you have a job to do thats waiting for them to achieve enlightenment Very Happy Go about it when your place is finished and will be a working example of what you are talking about!
vegplot

resistance is fertile wrote:
vegplot wrote:
resistance is fertile wrote:
cassy wrote:
Treacodactyl wrote:
Have you spoken to building control?


Yes, I'll be speaking to the local office, but I'd like to get my facts straight beforehand.


Its always helpful to use an independent DS, such as JHA , rather than the Local Authourity bods as they are working with you rather than 'enforcing' and also tend to be more up to date on such things as private water treatment etc.


I would counter that and say it may be beneficial to educate the local authority so others have an easier time and 'unusual' practices become accepted as standard. It does mean more work for you though.


I would agree but with the caveat that you dont spend your time trying to educate them when you have a job to do thats waiting for them to achieve enlightenment Very Happy Go about it when your place is finished and will be a working example of what you are talking about!


A good point and worth considering.
Treacodactyl

resistance is fertile wrote:
cassy wrote:
Treacodactyl wrote:
Have you spoken to building control?


Yes, I'll be speaking to the local office, but I'd like to get my facts straight beforehand.


Its always helpful to use an independent DS, such as JHA , rather than the Local Authourity bods as they are working with you rather than 'enforcing' and also tend to be more up to date on such things as private water treatment etc.


With my very little experience I wouldn't ask planners anything until I had researched it but my local building control have offered good, free advice and been easy to please, perhaps too easy.

Sounds like some can be much harder to please than others?
gom

cassy wrote:
I'm glad it went through for you gom but sorry to hear about the objectors. Thank you for adding all the details - I'm sure that will be useful to other people when submitting their planning applications.

Did you have to submit further details of the system for building control? That's the stage we're currently at.


Just a design and access statement (this was for a campsite), pp was granted, no one has appeared to inspect anything yet! We also had to submit sample materials. The applicable section of the design and access statement:

Design and Access Statement

Toilet/Shower block

The use of the building is apparent in the title. The building is of steel frame construction, finished in Deep Brunswick Green, clad in timber, the roof in matching green corrugated steel sheets with two GRP roof lights, and mounted on skids, permanent foundations are not required.
Essentially this is a portable unit, chosen because of it's minimal environmental impact.
A permanent structure would require foundations and the use of concrete. This would be totally unnecessary and detrimental to the surroundings.
Measurements are length 6.060m, width 3.050m, height at apex 2.92m. The entrance is offset from centre.
The structure is to house two showers, two wc's and two urinals and handwash basins.
The building can be accessed from ground level.
The location on the site is approximately central to allow ease of access from any point.
There are no other buildings on the camp site and none planned. This particular size and layout were chosen because it is of the minimum size practical to perform it's function, and the colours (green and natural timber) blend well with the surroundings, which are woodlands and a field. Landscaping is unnecessary and would entail introducing elements that would not be a natural part of the surrounding environment, the structure is designed to comply with relevant policies.
       Downsizer Forum Index -> Energy Efficiency and Construction
Page 1 of 1
You must set the ad_network_ads_377.txt file to be writable (check file name as well).