| Archive for Downsizer For an ethical approach to consumption |
| kj |
water recyclingHi thereapologies if i'm putting this in the wrong section..am new and finding my way around 
after spending most of last summer lugging watering cans around every evening and our arms growing about an inch we are looking at ways to help ourselves during the inevitable repeat hosepipe bans this year. I'm trying to get ahead of the game so we're all set by the time the nice weather comes
we have a large garden with a couple of big flower beds and a large veg plot, comprising of 6 beds. we currently have 2 big water butts and are about to add two more...I'm wondering about the best way of getting the water to the places i want via hoses from the butts. will an ordinary tap/hose connecter fit a water butt tap (the dur guy at the garden centre didnt know  )..and when/if i find out how to connect butt to hose, surely the water pressure is going to be a bit of a dribble as theres not much gravity to help it along so a sprinklery/spray type of nozzle wont work very well? just water spurting out of the end of the hose wont be a very gentle way of watering the lettuces? I'm thinking perhaps ii would be better to use a soaker type hose inbedded in the beds, but having never used a soaker hose am not sure if its better to be used with a timer? and is it possible to use a timer on a water butt??
also we dont have a shower so share one bath a day..if i could get that water (we dont use any nasties in our baths) out to the garden that would be great too..does anyone have any devices that they'd recommend for getting water from upstairs in a bath onto their garden? sorry lots of questions there!! if anyones got any tips i'd be really grateful btw, i have checked with the water comapny and hoses are allowed in our area as long as they arent connected to mains water supply.... thanks Kim |
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| tahir |
Good to see you start posting, this may help:
http://www.downsizer.net/Projects/Growing_Food/Gravity_fed_irrigation_system/ |
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| Treacodactyl |
I've connected a small 15mm hose to the tap on a standard water butt, just dip the end in boiling water for a minute to soften and then push on the tap. I've not needed to secure mine with a hose clip but you could if you wanted to (put it on before pushing the hose on). The hose to tap connector I have don't securely attach to the butt tap although some others might.
For help using bath water it might be worth reading through this thread: http://forum.downsizer.net/viewtopic.php?t=12472 |
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| dougal |
One can get waterbutt taps that are designed for connection to 'system' hoses.
Even on *eBay* This then means any timers, etc, can be connected. The pressure depends on the difference in height between the water level in the tank and the nozzle. (And how much you lose to friction/viscosity/turbulence in the pipes - which depends on the size, flowrate, etc). Mains water pressure is usually equivalent to something like 60 feet height difference... So, yes, think dribble/soak rather than spray. Most soaker hoses aren't intended to be buried... Gravity is your friend for moving water - as long as you are trying to go downhill! If you really, really must move it uphill then you are going to start investigating pumps. Most retail solar pond pumps are pretty pathetic, btw...
Consider an IBC as a waterbutt. 1000 litres capacity and sometimes available very cheaply. Remember water is heavy. A litre weighs a kg. Make sure your butt(s) are stable - and you want to be able to access the tap at the bottom... so it wants to be up a bit, somehow. Regarding "hosepipe bans". As previously discussed here, these apply (wherever in the UK they may be imposed) to water "originally supplied by the Water {Company}" - so technically you shouldn't be putting used showerwater through a hosepipe during a ban...  though I doubt it would get you into trouble!
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| wellington womble |
You'd have thought they wouldn't mind saving the sewerage!
HDRA sell hoses and seep hoses designed for water butts, I don't know whether you'd get a timer. I looked into pumps last year too, and I think screwfix had a decent one for about 60 quid, although after last years extended (and possibly still in place?!) hoseban ban in the south east, lots of the garden catalogues are selling small pumps too. There was one in KGM this month, I think - I'll have look. I also heard from a guy who heard it in the pub (yeah, one of those!) that the water companies are making it somehow against the rules to have more than one waterbutt - because it prevents more water from reaching the watertable, if people are storing it. Now , I have thought that they'd be grateful for not having to treat water that's only going to be used as 'greywater' anyway, but since when has common sense had anything to with life in general? Personally, I reckon its cadswallop, but I'm hoping Behemoth will be along later to confirm that! |
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| kj |
oh you guys are FAB! thanks so much for all the info and links..have been trawling through them all..very interesting stuff. re-visited the water company site and yes indeed, it would seem that even grey water is banned grr but just let them try and fine me 
i really would pop an artery if the 'one water butt' rule came into force..lets hope its just a rumour. whats an IBC? thanks for HDRA tip..yes they seem to have what i am looking for
keep em suggestions coming! thanks kim |
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| tahir |
http://tinyurl.com/yhh872 |
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| James |
I suppose the logic behind including grey water in the ban is that water co.'s recycle most of our water. Its implicit in their volume calculations that what they put in to the sytem is what they get out of the system, less a proportion lost in translation (so to speak...).
So if we're putting it on our gardens, that's increasing the amount thats lost to the environment. Having said all that, I have a small grey but. (oo-er) |
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| Behemoth |
Water companies actually need a steady throughput of water to stop the sewers silting up. There's nothing a sewerage manager likes than a moderate storm to give the system a good scouring. It saves on jetting costs. And yes the thing about water butts is cobblers. We get monitored by out regulator for how many we supply to customers, the more the better, though we do restrict to one per property on grounds of fairness and costs. In the great schme of things the amount of water held in water butts has no effect on the recharge of underground resources though it does have a small but measurable effect on reducing the amount of water we have to treat and supply. |
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| Behemoth |
Quite right, the estimation is about 5% lost in domestic use including garden watering. So 95% is returned to sewer. But the thing about not using water that was supplied by the company is just sloppy legislation written in a time when no one thought to use grey water. |
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| toggle |
or to stop someone filling up a water but straight from the tap, then using a hose out of that. |
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| Behemoth |
And that. 
Last year the water companies did a quick survey to see when the last time someone had action, other than a letter, taken against them for using a hosepipe during a ban and none could remember a case or find any records on one. |
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| kj |
i phoned 3 valleys water yesterday to clarify the situation and was told quite clearly that getting grey water onto my garden via the use of a hose would be quite within the law so thats good news. meant to take the womans name for proof but forgot, doh!
in any case it'll prob go into a water butt and will mix with rainwater so who's gonna argue with that... kim |
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| dougal |
Hi Kim (and welcome by the way). The lady you spoke to is unfamiliar with the Law. Its section 76, here: {please take a look} http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1991/Ukpga_19910056_en_9.htm#mdiv76 And it bans the use of hosepipes for "any water supplied by that undertaker" {meaning water company}. So hosepipe bans, in strict legality, do apply to 'grey water'... ... but whether or not the "letter of the law" has practical application is another matter entirely. The advice here was correct, and the call-centre wrong. Not for the first time! [/b] |
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| Behemoth |
We have better things to do...like loitering on the internet all day.
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| Penny Outskirts |
It's a tough job, but quite clearly someone has to do it
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| wellington womble |
I suppose one could abuse it by having large baths, especially to use the water on the garden (mind you, there's probably a limit to how many baths anyone can have!)
Don't hosepipe bans change? I thought some of them were only unattended hoses (ie sprinklers). I'm glad the water butt thing is cobblers though. How much do you charge for your butts, behemoth? (I know they'll only be for your customers, I just want an idea) I can see me having baths according to when I want to water the garden next year! How sad!
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| kj |
*sigh* you cant win can you..different rules whoever you talk to
well i for one am going to use the bloomin bathwater on the garden via a hose and if the water co. wants a fight then I'm up for it btw, i think you can these elsewhere but in case anyones hasnt seen them heres a link... i'm going to get one of these to help the job along... http://www.droughtbuster.co.uk/?gclid=CKzaks350IkCFThvMAodtBRYNg kim |