Archive for Downsizer For an ethical approach to consumption

sean	Windows 10 to be offered as free upgrade BBC Linky No idea if this is a good or bad thing. I assume they're trying to avoid the 'having-to-support-XP-for-ages-and-ages' scenario.
dpack	when my lappy's vista is no longer supported for all of it's built in online weaknesses i will keep it for ps and a few things i can do sort of ok and do all online stuff ,tunes etc with a very old pile of bits running on linux ,like what im doing at the mo the early days of doze such as ms dos was ace ,since then they have been more interested in cash than care or ease of use.
vegplot	with Cortana and HoloLens it can only be good. However there's no upgrade path from XP.
dpack	or from vista from the data on the beeb so as i see it they are offering to mend the carp(7 huge and messy,8 very huge messy and weird) stuff hat has been one of the last nails in the ms trust coffin compared to victorian steam engines or historical styles of firearm ms has probably had it's generation and a bit of cutting edge supremacy i wonder if there is a lost the plot version of moore's law for software developers
vegplot	or from vista from the data on the beeb so as i see it they are offering to mend the carp(7 huge and messy,8 very huge messy and weird) stuff hat has been one of the last nails in the ms trust coffin compared to victorian steam engines or historical styles of firearm ms has probably had it's generation and a bit of cutting edge supremacy i wonder if there is a lost the plot version of moore's law for software developers

Windows 7 was hugely successful. 8 much less so because of it's innovative but unpopular interface. Both are excellent productivity platforms.

The world changes however and desktop is not where the future lies. The move to 10 is a step towards a unified platform for other systems to integrate with not least Linux and OSX both of which are being fully supported to run Microsoft software natively on these platforms.

dpack

henchard

I moved from XP to Windows 8 because I had to get a much faster PC for Photoshop work.

Everyone was saying how awful Windows 8 is and 'don't go there'. To be honest I've found it very, very good and the most stable version of Windows I've ever had. It can be easily set up to look and feel just like older versions of Windows. I've no idea what the fuss was about.

The decision whether to take the risk of a free upgrade is going to be the difficult one!

dpack

if it works for you stick with it

i still have a version of 98 sp something that is fine for running some (at the time)very posh sound software when i have opportunity to play with noise.

the "must upgrade to a new ,better thing" only really benefits the thing sellers

for simple and useful ms dos on a 486 processor could do some good stuff with software and data that would fit on a tiny drive

my vista lappy has about 200g of os which uses a fair bit of ram just to keep alive and is usually not doing more than this lean machine is at less than 10 % of that

Shane

Re: Windows 10 to be offered as free upgrade

I assume they're trying to avoid the 'having-to-support-XP-for-ages-and-ages' scenario.

No - I think they're just trying to get people to use it. I'm perfectly happy with my Windows 7, can't bloody stand the sight of Windows 8, so never upgraded.

If Windows 10 is free and looks okay, I'll upgrade, so I guess I'm exactly the kind of user that MS is aiming at. henchard

the "must upgrade to a new ,better thing" only really benefits the thing sellers

Couldn't agree more but I had to upgrade from XP because software I needed will only run on 64bit Windows.

I certainly won't be an early adopter of Windows 10 but presumeably if I do upgrade (free) I will get MS support for much longer than I would if I stick with Win 8.

can't bloody stand the sight of Windows 8, so never upgraded.

I keep hearing this from people but still haven't worked out why people have this opinion. As I say I moved from XP to Win 8 and had it configured to work in almost the same way on a desktop within about 20 minutes. It's been running pretty much 24 hours a day since last May and is as solid as a rock. vegplot

my vista lappy has about 200g of os which uses a fair bit of ram just to keep alive and is usually not doing more than this lean machine is at less than 10 % of that

If you're running Vista you deserve or want the pain. vegplot

cross platform is probably a good move

i was a big ms fan from early 80's to early 000's since then it has been a matter of making useful software or peripheral hardware work and has not always been a happy mutually beneficent deal from my point of view

Steve Ballmer's hand at the helm didn't do Microsoft much good during early part of this century. Much like his persona it was a blustering buffoon with half baked ideas of Windows Everywhere domination. It turned a lot of people off.

Under Nadella it's taking a very different approach. We're already seeing some very sound robust products come out of MS including cross platform and/or opensource such as HaloLens, Cortana, Azure, vNext, and Hub.

vNext of particular interest. A cross platform developer framework that is truly opensource. mark

The reason it is free to upgrade from Windows 7 or 8 FOR THE FIRST YEAR is to get the platform established in a short time frame.

If you decide not to upgrade early you will probably have to pay to upgrade later on

There is some adopters that later adopters will have to buy windows as annual subscription but if you upgrade in the first year that is valid for the life of your machine ! I may have misunderstood that as their is a lot of contradictory information out there..

I presently have windows 7 on my desktop which I like and windows 8 on my laptop which I like less. My tablet and phone are android.

Microsoft are probably trying to entice me and those like me to go Microsoft across the board ..

But right now I use Libre Office and Google Drive and Dropbox and Evernote and Googlemail as my mainstays. I got my feet in a number of camps and am resistant to jumping into a single Apple Type ecosystem which traps you ! so we''l see.

So I only keep data in forms I can easily transfer and access from many platforms. The next few years could go many ways. Its hard to tell !

Betamax was a great format and the Sinclair QL had great specs but they were a dead end! My Space was everywhere! What happened to compuserve?

Stay flexible and make sure you can always export your data is my motto !

But I'll probably upgrade my laptop and Desktop to Windows 10 when it comes oldish chris

What I think is a shame is that this anti-Windows 8 started at all. Looking at any Comments page of an on-line report about W8, there is a lot of strong language and very little information. From what I can make out, W8 is very good (independent reviews reckon that it is much more secure that earlier versions). Professionals seem to like it.

However, MS somehow "overlooked" a crucial requirement of a large number of users. Over in Linuxland we had the same sort of problem when desktop designers decided what the future will be like, and created radically different UIs. The screams and abuse! (I ducked out and use a "light-weight" alternative that does the trick.)

If I were wedded to Windows, I'd explore the trial (beta) version, which I believe can be road tested, and see how far I can modify the UI to make it look like XP or W7. oldish chris

Found this: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?px=Microsoft-Windows-10-Features&page=news_item

Best bullet point preview I've seen. jema

whenever I have had the misfortune to try windows 8 I have found it deeply unpleasant. The interface is not discoverable you have to know which keys to press in advance and that simply sucks.

It at least by default forgets the fact that the majority of users are using a non touch screen monitor and a mouse.

This is where I get completely baffled. It is merely a few clicks to set Windows 8 to boot straight to Desktop it looks and feels almost exactly the same as my old XP.

Here's my Win 8 desktop that I go straight to when I boot up. You never have to see the Windows tiles if you don't want to.

Looks fine to me. I work on a mix of XP, Vista and 7 machines, I don't really have problems with any of them. Will upgrade to 10 Nick

If you miss right clicking on the start menu for your programmes there are third party replacements; but even easier just put a folder called my programmes on the taskbar and drag any shortcuts into it. You then have a pop up menu of your most used programmes (next to the Windows button bottom left on my taskbar).

Does it allow you to shrink pictures, tho? Wink

henchard

Does it allow you to shrink pictures, tho? Wink

Resized at your request sir! Nick

It is the greatest operating system, ever. Smile

jema

[quote="jema:]

So a few mysterious actions will stop it being f*cked up. I don't know those actions... I expect to boot to something I can f8cking navigate without knowing mysteries.[/quote]

Sounds Right to me !

Smile

henchard

or from vista from the data on the beeb

so as i see it they are offering to mend the carp(7 huge and messy,8 very huge messy and weird) stuff hat has been one of the last nails in the ms trust coffin

compared to victorian steam engines or historical styles of firearm ms has probably had it's generation and a bit of cutting edge supremacy

i wonder if there is a lost the plot version of moore's law for software developers

Windows 7 was hugely successful. 8 much less so because of it's innovative but unpopular interface. Both are excellent productivity platforms.

I absolutely detest it because it cuts down my productivity - how do you stop the cursor randomly jumping around the page when you're trying to type something? Nick

You on a Dell laptop? Rob R

No, Acer Nick

I doubt it's the os. Disable the scratch pad. See if it helps. Rob R

OK, will give it a go Shane

So a few mysterious actions will stop it being f*cked up. I don't know those actions... I expect to boot to something I can f8cking navigate without knowing mysteries.

So the software is 'deeply unpleasant' because the operator can't be bothered to do the following

Right-click any open area in the taskbar, then click Properties.

Click the Navigation tab, then check the box next to 'Go to the desktop instead of Start when I sign in'.
I think Jema's point is that he just wants it to work from the beginning without having to be set up to be more usable. I've used Windows 8 many times, and it drives me mental. I especially hate the fact that I have to move the cursor sort of to the right somewhere and, if I'm really, really lucky, four random symbols will pop up, one of which will open a screen that will allow me to search for the control panel. It's two clicks away in Windows 7, but requires a miracle and a whole lot of patience to find it in Windows 8. Why should I have to spend half-an-hour on Google and then play around a whole lot to make that process quicker (if it can be made quicker at all)? And that's just one thing that needs sorting out - by the time I've configured it to be easier to use I may as well have written my own operating system.

Harrumph, I say! jema

The operator does not start off knowing that option exists, its the first time I have heard of it.

I don't expect to have to do a particular click of the mouse on somewhere that has nothing indicated about it and then navigate to find an option which you say changes the way the whole things works.

Previous windows were far more discoverable. oldish chris

Over in Linuxland, it is assumed that people transferring from a different OS will not find the "intuitive" system particularly intuitive.

There is an on-line manual for installing Ubuntu (https://help.ubuntu.com/stable/installation-guide/en.armhf/) and for the desktop (I use XFCE) there is a wiki (http://wiki.xfce.org/howto).

Amazing what a bunch of enthusiasts can do, and I would have thought that a market leading company would have something far better.

(Unless they don't give a damn said the Troll). henchard

I think Jema's point is that he just wants it to work from the beginning without having to be set up to be more usable. I've used Windows 8 many times, and it drives me mental. I especially hate the fact that I have to move the cursor sort of to the right somewhere and, if I'm really, really lucky, four random symbols will pop up, one of which will open a screen that will allow me to search for the control panel. It's two clicks away in Windows 7, but requires a miracle and a whole lot of patience to find it in Windows 8. Why should I have to spend half-an-hour on Google and then play around a whole lot to make that process quicker (if it can be made quicker at all)? And that's just one thing that needs sorting out - by the time I've configured it to be easier to use I may as well have written my own operating system.

Harrumph, I say!

Once again I disagree, the control panel can be found in one click in Windows 8.1 (as can Task manager, shut down etc); just right click on the Windows button.

Now I'll agree that Microsoft did 'cock up' trying to make it 'all singing and dancing' in the first place but most of the configuration issues (that mostly annoyed desktop users) were sorted with the 8.1 upgrade.

As I say I'm no fan of Microsoft but Windows 8.1 is a very, very good operating system IMHO. As I say in 8 or 9 months of 24 hour a day use it has been rock solid. vegplot

As I say in 8 or 9 months of 24 hour a day use it has been rock solid.

It certainly is that.

For those who have problem or issues in using it there are a mass of how to videos on YouTube and other online resources that makes it far more intuitive.

Use Windows 8.1 on a Surface and you'll see why they did what they did. jema

I'm sure if you persevere it is fine, but I can boot up a windows7 machine and do things having not been in windows for months, but if I'm on someone else's windows8 box having been asked to help with something I'm stuffed, in that scenario you can hardly go around altering their settings to make it usable even if you knew how. vegplot

That's why we're getting Windows 10. RichardW

That's why we're getting Windows 10.

When & can I down load it once & then apply to all the pc's we have here? sean

You can register now. It's going to be free for a limited period apparently. vegplot

That's why we're getting Windows 10.

When & can I down load it once & then apply to all the pc's we have here?

From 29th July I believe. Bodrighy

Just got a notification asking me to reserve it and it will automatically download when it is ready. Full upgrade no cost.

Pete RichardW

We have 4 or 5 devices that will want the upgrade. Is it possible to down load it once then apply to each? If not then when it does become available we wont have any internet left that month & even if we did it would be unusable with all that downloading going on. vegplot

I presume it will be made available as a download. You can download it now but as it's the preview version it's unlikely to be stable or complete. Hairyloon

Does anybody know how Windows 10 copes with multi-boot systems?
Does it do what Windows normally does and wipe everything else off?
I would assume not, if it is upgrading one Windows to another, but I would rather know before I start...

Specialist forums are the best place to search.

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/insider/forum/insider_wintp-insider_install/windows-10-multiboot/306ae43e-efeb-4f99-821a-7714434449e1?auth=1 RichardW

I'm a bit peed off with win 10.

I dint want to wait for the system to download it when it wanted to due to our limited internet. So I used the download option on the website.

However after downloading all 4ish gig of it I now find that its only for a full install with new number & wont upgrade my win 8.1 machine. tahir

I did that for 4 pcs and it worked OK, although on my own one I can't get Edge to run, and it took me a while to get Calculator back (amongst other stupid stupid issues that you'd have thought they'd be desperate to avoid this time round)

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