Another electric fence question- earthed fence lines?

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Another electric fence question- earthed fence lines?

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Louisdog

Joined: 22 Mar 2005
Posts: 716
Location: South Wales

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 08 8:24 pm Post subject: Another electric fence question- earthed fence lines?

Hi all

I recently posted on electric fencing and wasn't sure whether to post on that thread or start a new one so I hope this is ok.

We have now started constructing our new, improved and hopefully foxproof chicken and duck run, we are using 4 foot tall wooden posts and 9 strands of wire. We are thinking about alternating the wires so that some are connected to earth rather than live, so that the fox gets a bigger shock, and even if his feet are all off the ground.

However I am worried that this will means that if we or our dogs touch a live and earth wire accidentally, we will get one heck of a shock, far worse than we would if we just had live wires on the fence.

Has anyone got any experience of such a system or got any comments for or against, please?

Thanks for any help you can offer

Cheers
Alex

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 08 8:27 pm Post subject:
We use that system when the cattle are breaking through the fence too much, normally they have two live wires holding them back & haven't experienced any problems but it certainly is effective!

Louisdog

Joined: 22 Mar 2005
Posts: 716
Location: South Wales

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 08 8:39 pm Post subject:
Have you ever touched it by accident? Did it hurt like mad?! We are wusses and our dogs are real wusses so don't want to accidentally hurt them! I guess it must be much more effective a shock if you find it helps stop cattle getting through, where two live wires fail. Ouch.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 08 8:53 pm Post subject:
It's the same shock as a well earthed standard set up, just gives them a better contact for a more reliable shock (some of the offenders on the cattle side have particularly thick woolly coats), particularly over distances. So yes, it hurts, but no more than than a good ground earth on wet grass.

RichardW

Joined: 24 Aug 2006
Posts: 8443
Location: Llyn Peninsular North Wales

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 08 8:55 pm Post subject:
A glancing touch hurts lots more than grasping it firmly in the hand as long as you are not in direct contact with the ground. On the few times I forget & touch the wire whilst directly earthed (kneeling down or touching metal gates ect) you do get a good belt but its not deadly. The dogs will only do it once & then keep away just the same as with a normal fence. Justme

VSS

Joined: 14 Jan 2007
Posts: 2845
Location: Llyn Peninsula, North Wales

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 08 4:48 pm Post subject: Re: Another electric fence question- earthed fence lines?

Louisdog wrote:

Hi all
We are thinking about alternating the wires so that some are connected to earth rather than live, so that the fox gets a bigger shock, and even if his feet are all off the ground.

If the fox has all his feet off the ground when he gets the shock then the chances are he's already half way through the fence, and the shock will drive him forward. Then he's shut in with the hens.

If you alternate the wires then every other wire (the earths) are effectively dud, and won't do any good unless they are touched at the same time as a live one. You'd need to space them at very close intervals for this to be effective.

Don't worry about getting shocks yourself. You aren't going to put your wet nose on the fence whilst standing in your bare feet on wet grass!
I don't even turn ours off to move it!

(For goodness sake don't pee on it though!)

Louisdog

Joined: 22 Mar 2005
Posts: 716
Location: South Wales

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 08 5:31 pm Post subject:

Thanks for your replies.

Justme, unfortunately my dogs don't seem to remember about the current fence permanently, although they usually only touch it about once a year, poor things. It makes them yelp!

VSS I hadn't considered that but yes the earthed lines are effectively duds aren't they, hmm. I also forgot that the shock I get touching it in wellies is going to be less than a fox would get on his nose, his fur might be a good insulator though I guess.

I still haven't decided how to wire it yet but we have put the insulators on the posts, we are having them 6, 12, 18, 24, 30, 42, 54, 66, 78, 90, 102 and 114 cm off the ground, I hope these spacings work. We used wider ones in our last place but we didn't have as much of a fox problem there.

Cheers

Blue Sky

Joined: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 7658
Location: France

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 08 5:49 pm Post subject: Re: Another electric fence question- earthed fence lines?

VSS wrote:

(For goodness sake don't pee on it though!)

Like Pricey did you mean.

Louisdog

Joined: 22 Mar 2005
Posts: 716
Location: South Wales

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 08 5:52 pm Post subject:
ouch!

Louisdog

Joined: 22 Mar 2005
Posts: 716
Location: South Wales

Posted: Mon Jan 28, 08 12:23 pm Post subject:
OK it's all set up and we didn't bother with any earth strands, but each strand is a separate piece of wire so we can do that in future if needed. It's giving out just over 7000 volts according to the tester, and no sign of foxy inside the fence so far, hooray. Hubby accidentally touched the wires the other day, his scream could be heard for miles Cheers

Woodburner

Joined: 28 Apr 2006
Posts: 2904
Location: Essex

Posted: Thu Feb 14, 08 4:26 pm Post subject:
Defra has a really good manual online here about page 23 is the recommenced spacing of wires for foxes, alternate wires are earthed. It looks like foxes are the hardest things to keep in or out - well there's a surprise!

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 45472
Location: yes

Posted: Thu Feb 14, 08 6:00 pm Post subject:
woolly coats ? do i know these malcontents? shall we have them eaten ?

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