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bimini



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 156

PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 10 9:18 pm    Post subject: Cider Reply with quote
    

I'm ready to embark on my first cider making session. I have the apples and a press. All I need now is a bit of advice! How best to pulp the apples? If I use a garden shredder do I need to worry about the resinous build up from Leylandii that has built up in the shredder? What is the best yeast to use... I've been told champagne yeast is best... but Hop and Grape do a specific cider yeast... what do you use?

sean
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 42207
Location: North Devon
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 10 9:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Cider Reply with quote
    

bimini wrote:
I'm ready to embark on my first cider making session. I have the apples and a press. All I need now is a bit of advice! How best to pulp the apples?

Dunno
bimini wrote:
If I use a garden shredder do I need to worry about the resinous build up from Leylandii that has built up in the shredder?

Yes
bimini wrote:
What is the best yeast to use... I've been told champagne yeast is best... but Hop and Grape do a specific cider yeast... what do you use?

I wouldn't worry too much, I've used a range of yeasts for cider and my conclusion is that the quality of the fruit is far more critical than what yeast you use.

Mafro



Joined: 17 Dec 2009
Posts: 68
Location: Kent
PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 10 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

What volume of apples are you to be processing?

Last year I made 5 gal of cider, and all the apples went through the shredder on my food processor.

This year I built myself a scratter and I've pressed 100+ litres of cider.

You can get a nice sized post, and just pummle the apples in a large bucket, the ides is to get the apples down to tiny little pieces to enable you to extract as much juice as possible.

As for the garden shredder, I wouldn't use one unless it was brand new. Any material that has previously gone though the shredder is likely to at best taint the flavour, and at worst make you very ill.

I've used both yeasts you have mentioned this year, how they work out I wont be able to tell you for a couple of months, but they will both be fine
Its bread yeast that you dont want to use.

bimini



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 156

PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 10 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Quote:
Last year I made 5 gal of cider


How many apples will I have to press to get 5 gals?

woody guthrie



Joined: 28 Jan 2009
Posts: 209
Location: Cork, Ireland
PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 10 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Mafro wrote:


As for the garden shredder, I wouldn't use one unless it was brand new. Any material that has previously gone though the shredder is likely to at best taint the flavour, and at worst make you very ill.



Would a used shredder really make anyone ill ? As long it's only been used for vegatation there would be no more contaminants on it than are on the fruit itself, after all cider is supposed to be a fairly robust brew.

Hopefully this is the case as I intend to use my shredder as it looks the least tiring method.

yummersetter



Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 3241
Location: Somerset
PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 10 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

It's up to you if you decide to use a manky shredder, but I suggest you don't let anyone you care about drink the cider.

woody guthrie



Joined: 28 Jan 2009
Posts: 209
Location: Cork, Ireland
PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 10 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Can't be any worse than using bare feet to crush grapes.

Who sterilizises their cider press or the material used to wrap the apple pulp before squeezing?

yummersetter



Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 3241
Location: Somerset
PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 10 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

um, me actually j - though I mainly make apple juice (pasteurised) rather than cider.

I know the alcohol is supposed to kill all living organisms (including human brains, kidneys and liver) but most of what I make is for my nearest and dearest or valued friends and when I make stuff I want it to be made with more care and better ingredients than the kind I can buy in shops or it's not worth the effort.

I grew up and still live in a tiny Somerset village with a history of farm scrumpy making over centuries - rotten apples, dead rats, mud with chicken and sheep droppings and all that rubbish being chucked in the barrel, and the stuff was near lethal, there were no healthy cider drinkers over forty years old here when I was growing up. And that was without using a shredder that had disposed of a laurel hedge the season before.

The middle class cider makers that their widows sold the farms to are making a version that may not be so folksy but it's way better tasting and unlikely to kill you before you reach fifty.

gil
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 18409

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 10 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

woody guthrie wrote:
Can't be any worse than using bare feet to crush grapes.

Who sterilizises their cider press or the material used to wrap the apple pulp before squeezing?


Yes, even when making wine with a much higher alcohol content than cider, I sterilise everything before starting, and would not even think of using implements that had been used for non-edible plant purposes without a thorough clean and sterilisation. The other reason being that any contamination that won't dissolve in water / soap WILL probably dissolve in alcohol and add itself to your brew.

Don't do it.

Mafro



Joined: 17 Dec 2009
Posts: 68
Location: Kent
PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 10 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

I steralise anything and everything when I am making any form of alcohol. After all that hard work, the last thing I want is for some nasty to ruin it.

As for the shredder. I don't know what has been put through it previously. If it has ever been used to shred anything from the yew tree it could make you really ill, if not possibly kill you. There are also many plants/weeds that commonly grow in your garden that could make you ill. Dogs mercury for example.

And if like me you have taken the time to ensure that the press is made from a hard wood such as oak to ensure it doesn't taint the cider in the process (as pine would), the last think I want it old tree and shrub clippings in with my mash.

Mafro



Joined: 17 Dec 2009
Posts: 68
Location: Kent
PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 10 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

bimini wrote:
Quote:
Last year I made 5 gal of cider


How many apples will I have to press to get 5 gals?


This all depends on how efficient your press is, and what variet of apples you are pressing.

I haven't done any specific tests, but on average I get 2.2 gallons of juice from one large 75L rhino tub full of apples. This works out to about 30l of pulped apples.

James



Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 2866
Location: York
PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 10 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

I get about a gallon of juice from around 4-5 gallons of apples. desert apples yield more juice. Windfall apples that have been left to ripen on the ground yield more juice.

I use champagne yeast because it ferments fast and clean, gives a low ester fermentation (a neutral flavour that allows the apple flavour to come out), and it clears really rapidly giving a firm sediment thats easy to work with. I recently quizzed my homebrew shop bloke about cider yeast and he couldn't really give me a decent answer on what the difference is. A friend at work uses general purpose wine yeast with good results, so as Sean says, the yeast is probably not that important. Having said that, I'm just trying a malic acid reducing yeast (MA33) that may give a different taste.

I don't sterilise the pressing equipment. It must be clean, but there really is no point in sterilising- it's a total waste of time and effort. Although washed, the windfalls are far from sterile, and probably still contain bits of soil and the odd woodlouse. As soon as the pulp touches the press, the press isn't sterile any more. You don't sterilise until you've got the juice. Once I've got a gallon of juice, I add sulphite solution equivalent to 1 campden tablet, seal the demijohn and allow it to stand for 24 hours. A sediment will settle out. Next day, I syphon off the sediment, and add an active yeast.

This works, every time.

paolo



Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 10 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

I use an old waste disposal unit to shred my apples.

mochyn



Joined: 21 Dec 2004
Posts: 24585
Location: mid-Wales
PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 10 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

James wrote:
I don't sterilise the pressing equipment. It must be clean, but there really is no point in sterilising- it's a total waste of time and effort. Although washed, the windfalls are far from sterile, and probably still contain bits of soil and the odd woodlouse. As soon as the pulp touches the press, the press isn't sterile any more. You don't sterilise until you've got the juice.


Spot on.

We don't sterilize although we do wash.

We also don't use any yeast unless there's no sign of fermentation. We make several barrels of cider every winter and it never fails!

We crush using a clean fence post in a big bucket.

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