Calf for next year.

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Calf for next year.
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Bulgarianlily

Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 1667
Location: South West Mountains of Bulgaria

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 6:01 pm Post subject: Calf for next year.

Can anyone help with the sums for keeping a calf? We are being offered a calf in Spring, either at 2 months or three months old. We are told that at three months we can wean it and therefore don't need to milk feed, can I check that with people here? If we raise it until it is 10 or 11 months old, on grass with some supplimentary feeding, we are told we should get about 180 to 200 kilos meat, sounds a lot, is that a reasonable expectation? The calf would be from a large dairy cow. Costs of buying a calf would be 100 euros at 2 months or 200 euros for a month later. I am trying to work out how economic it would be. It would be going out with the village herd every day once big enough.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 7:04 pm Post subject:
First thing I would say is who is doing the telling? Ask someone who knows and isn't set to benefit. I don't know how the economics work out there but the amounts of meat sound like a very intensely fed animal at 11 months. Take a look at my other thread with the eblex link in - the pro's are loosing money at the moment & if you want beef, there are easier & cheaper ways.

Truffle

Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 526

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 7:33 pm Post subject:
Out of interest Rob, is it economical at all for a smallholder to buy a young calf and raise for meat the same year (no overwintering) on just grass? Just wondering why people don't seem to do it, I guess it's due to figures?

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 7:46 pm Post subject:

They really need at least two years, if that was the aim your best chance would be to buy a yearling that has been reared by it's mother & overwintered & then finish it on grass at 18 months, or buy it at 18m & finish by 30m.

You can finish them quicker but it does need a good amount of grain. At current prices it isn't economical full stop. To make a decent return on anything I think returns need to double & costs to stay static, for a minimum wage.

Bulgarianlily

Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 1667
Location: South West Mountains of Bulgaria

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 8:43 pm Post subject:

No one here keeps a calf for longer than the first year, i.e. they don't over winter them as they don't have enough winter feed here. Everyone but us currently keeps a calf in the village, and the infomation is from an assortment of villagers, that would be about 60 houses that have a cow and calf. It was a jolly big 11month old calf we watched being butchered yesterday but I didn't see the meat on any scales so I am going on their educated guesses of how much meat they got. They reckon it was between 150 to 180 kilos with very little grain feed but we have a very long grass season here. I will check the price of feed from the feed supplier but I believe I could get it from a local cooperative (shovel it into your own bags) at 3 to 4 euros a 50 kilo bag and then get it milled in the next village, but that would take rat proof storage....

We are under huge social pressure here to have a milking cow, and the village seems to have united behind the idea that we should get a calf as a first step! Hard to explain if you don't live here.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 9:16 pm Post subject:
I know absolutely nothing about your area, but it might be worth a go if everyone is at it. The cost of slaughter is a big one over here. The weights they are quoting might also include the bones, offal, etc. Cattle are the easiest animals to keep, and it might be worthwhile if you'd enjoy the experience?

Paul Sill

Joined: 16 Jan 2009
Posts: 118

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 9:31 pm Post subject:
I wouldnt want to keep a calf on its own, they are very social animals.

gil
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 18409

Posted: Mon Nov 14, 11 9:48 pm Post subject:

Bulgarianlily wrote:

We are under huge social pressure here to have a milking cow, .

Makes a change from the usual 'keeping up with the Joneses'.

Mrs R

Joined: 15 Aug 2008
Posts: 7202

Posted: Tue Nov 15, 11 10:36 am Post subject:

ha huge social pressure to keep a milking cow, never thought I'd hear that!

the calves must be wintered at some point if they are 11 months old and I agree that to get to those weights there must be some serious grain involved.

I reared a brown swiss once which I'm guessing will be similar to what your neighbours have perhaps. He was calved in July and I had him on milk for 3months (yes you can wean at 8wks, but the longer they have on milk the better really) he had grain (beef nuts) and hay over winter and looked a bit poor come spring. I whacked him out on some good grass (mobstocked) and he quickly made up the weight. He was slaughtered in the september without any summer grain, looked good, and we got 90kilos of meat back (as in, butchered ready to eat, not on the hook). 60% kill out. No doubt if I had stuffed him with grain all down the line and he hadn't lost ground over the first winter he could have achieved 100 and some, but I'd think 200 would be lucky, and bear in mind he was 14months, not 11.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Tue Nov 15, 11 1:32 pm Post subject:
As a marker I just had a Dexter intact bull slaughtered. 18 months old, including last, hard winter. Grass/hay fed until the day he died (then he got a handful of nuts to bribe him into the pen) and slaughter weight was 225kg. Not enough fat on him if pushed, but otherwise grand. About 70% of that came back as boneless meat. Um. I never weaned him.

Bulgarianlily

Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 1667
Location: South West Mountains of Bulgaria

Posted: Tue Nov 15, 11 2:28 pm Post subject:
Thanks for all this, food for thought as they say.

Ty Gwyn

Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 4563
Location: Lampeter

Posted: Tue Nov 15, 11 7:14 pm Post subject:
What breed of cattle do you have in Bulgaria?

Mutton

Joined: 09 May 2009
Posts: 1508

Posted: Sat Nov 19, 11 7:36 pm Post subject:

Question - have you found out the root of the social pressure to have a cow?

Just wondering because 17th century economics, if a family had a house cow they were usually safely above the poverty line. It may originate from that.

Know very little about Bulgaria. Have read all of Annie Hawes books about life in Italy, and extreme rural poverty was present there in living memory, so wondering if that is in the background of the social pressure to have a house cow.

Bulgarianlily

Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 1667
Location: South West Mountains of Bulgaria

Posted: Sat Nov 19, 11 9:32 pm Post subject:
It is very much as you suppose. Being without a cow we even get given the left overs from death feasts, traditionally given to the poorest of the villagers! They honestly feel that we are being obstinate and stupid for not having one, and barely a week goes by without someone raising the subject. Adverts for cows are pointed out to us....

Mutton

Joined: 09 May 2009
Posts: 1508

Posted: Sun Nov 20, 11 10:20 am Post subject:
Thanks. BTW is there still some form of communal grazing system, with all the cows going up to common pasture each day?

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