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relaxing pollution enforcement, with fishy update
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dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 21 10:39 am    Post subject: relaxing pollution enforcement, with fishy update Reply with quote
    

the details are available
follow the money can be educational

another brick in the rubble

Last edited by dpack on Wed Feb 09, 22 9:49 am; edited 1 time in total

gz



Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 8016
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland
PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 21 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Just seen the surfers against sewage map of South West England

Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 14375

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 21 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Our local sewage disposal company has already been fined vast amounts of money for putting out contaminated outflow, but I suppose they can do that any time they like now. Totally unacceptable, and going back about 40 years on pollution control. If it was just 'licencible' for a short term until they get supplies of the chemicals back it might be understandable, but this seems to be a total relaxation.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 21 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

follow the money

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 21 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

unknown cause

this problem has gone from local noticed to wider what and why?

it may not be anything to do with any sort of human activity, umm,

fishing?, it can be messy, but this seems extreme for multi habitat bycatch

historic sea bed surprise?. possible. it should be detectable.
ditto geological surprise

massive amount of untreated waste down the river in the middle? possible. could it have that payload? not sure

tis nasty and it needs identifying

Shane



Joined: 31 Oct 2005
Posts: 3467
Location: Doha. Is hot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 21 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Unlikely to be sewage, as a major release would kill by depleting the water of oxygen, and that would affect the entire water column. I'd guess that something toxic and heavier than water has been released, which would also explain the near-dead rather than completely dead state of many of the crustaceans. Interesting that there are no bottom-dwelling fish there, but maybe whatever has caused it affects crustaceans more than other groups of species.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 21 8:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

latest news

the first ones started washing up a few weeks ago, there are far more and more places now

re bottom dwelling fish, overfishing cleared those waters decades ago, there are some inshore fish but not many, i dont bother fishing along that part of the ne coast, but there were plenty of shellfish

if it was a river discharge i would have thought there would be dead things in the river or becks, this killzone seems to be just offshore and quite a few miles long(the tides and currents are a bit odd so from a single point a pollutant might go 1/3 north and 2/3 south in a slooshing sort of way)

plenty of active and legacy industrial sites including assorted chemicals in use and in historical on site waste dumps

a boat might have lost a container, there is a smallish container facility and passing coastal trade which could have placed a problem on the seabed with no signs on shore

even without data on what it is, some sort of human activity does seem the most likely cause with plenty of candidates

if it is disease, why so local and multi species?

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 21 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

less dead perhaps no longer a target rich environment

insufficient data for meaningful answer, so far. it is unusual, and it will affect the ecosystem of the area biggly

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 21 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

shellfishy news

not sewage, cables or siesmic is a start, they are still washing up though

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 22 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

fishy folk thoughts

the conclusions as to cause may be speculative, the methodology of go fishing and notice no shellfish life, critters that they usually harvest in an almost sustainable way, from the tees to scarbrough and up to 3 miles out seems valid

the current from the tees southwards works like that
the tees has hosted a variety of industries

it is claimed that no chemical evidence might be due to no comprehensive chemical searches

hint start with is that still "normal" sea water/ mud/ dead crabs/sick mutts etc or are there strange elements, isotopes or organics from a "normal" profile in available samples

i might start with elements and isotopes and looking for odd hplc/glc spikes
parts per million or less is no prob with decent kit, enough to kill should be detectable

what are the survivors might also be educational, that needs sampling over area and time

something seems to have harried the coast

Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 14375

PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 22 8:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

They are saying chemical analysis has been carried out, but only saying it has been carried out on the material dredged out and disposed of at sea. That is not the same as saying that there are no contaminants disturbed by the dredging, although it is unlikely they could be separated. It does sound like either chemical or algal poisoning.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 22 8:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

yep

method

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 22 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

fisherfolk know algal

there is no data for algal

full periodic table would be my first move, has any element a high or low score from the baseline data.
i cant remember the name of the kit but tis the one that does forced spectroscope for atomic mass

that will do element and isotope profile. organics and biologicals are complex but can be done very accurately

seek and ye shall find, what you find depends on how effectively you look

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 42968
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 22 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

mass spectrometer, decent chap

tahir



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 44994
Location: Essex
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 22 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-59995387

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