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What is cider ?
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Falstaff



Joined: 27 May 2009
Posts: 1014

PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 15 6:39 pm    Post subject:  Reply with quote    

So it seems "They" can make fruit or any flavoured cider "they" like, but would have to pay duty as though it were a weak wine.

"We" (small tax free producers do not have that luxury, because the "duty free" only relates to CIDER and although you can "Gee it up" with sugar and you can use apple concentrated juice if you want that's about it !

Bodger and you (Anyone else producing for sale ? ) are trying to "keep the faith" and produce "Pukka country cider" from just apples and skill and loving attention - is that about the state of it ?

Lorrainelovesplants



Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 6514
Location: Dordogne
PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 15 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Rather than the 'them' and us divide, think of it like this - commercial cider producers are in it to make money (and there is nothing wrong with that). People like choice. There is nothing wrong with that.
I like to know what is in my food and thus, Im pretty open and honest about what is in my cider. Not all producers are.

I like to use apples that I can get within 40 miles of here. Most of them come from within 5 miles, but I like to be honest and so my website states within 40 miles.
I press the apples and use the full undilted juice to ferment. When I take it off the lees into a same size maturation barrel there is a little gaps (to account for the sediment left behind). To prevent air getting to the batch and spoiling it - I add tap water. This means Im adding about 2 litres to 180 litres to make up to 200. I never add any sugar unless Im doing bottle conditioned - which means Im doing a secondary ferment in the bottle with a very small (Im not giving you the recipe) amount of sugar.
I dont really care what other people are doing.
People like what I do, so I keep doing it, but I like to try and deal honestly, and its a shame business so I try not to talk about people behind their backs.

Lorrainelovesplants



Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 6514
Location: Dordogne
PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 15 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

sorry...small business....

Falstaff



Joined: 27 May 2009
Posts: 1014

PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 15 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Lorrainelovesplants wrote:


...............You wont see Kiwi or vanilla going into any cider here!
(although Ive made some with a touch of elderflower FOR MY PERSONAL CONSUMPTION).....................


Without giving away any trade secrets Lorraine - I'd love to have your advice on whether to "capture" eldeflower taste - say as cordial or a weak wine and then combine it into the cider as the apples become ready, or whether the right way is to make the cider , then add the eldeflowers at this time of year, to the almost complete brew ?

Personally - I'm looking at a bit of a cheat with Lidl apple juice and natural elderflower which are ready just now !

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 35694
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 15 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

freeze the elderflowers and use them later

Falstaff



Joined: 27 May 2009
Posts: 1014

PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 15 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

You may be right dpack, but I suspect the esters may be diminished or changed with the freezing.

Lorrainelovesplants



Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 6514
Location: Dordogne
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Falstaff - Im not a purist, but I dont think combining cider with elderflower wine will work for you.

make the cider and keep it as cider. make some elderflower cordial.
You can add a touch of elderflower cordial to cider to add some floral notes, BUT be aware that this will referment due to the sugar content, so you may want to watch how much you use, and how you use it.

Ive used a touch of elderflower cordial to add a bit of fizz to my fully fermented cider, creating a sparkling cider with a slightly light floral edge. This was done in bottle and has been quite nice, if a little lively.

Nick



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34031
Location: Hereford
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Nick wrote:
I'll name names. Bulmers (strongbow, etc) use concentrate from Germany, despite being based amongst orchards.

Westons (Old Rosie, for example) use local apples, and quite a lot of sheep shit.


And, today, (unsurprisingly) I find Carlsberg Somersby is made, to order, in around 9 days, from pure concentrate, sourced globally, based on price.

If the sun comes out, they increase production so you can be drinking it next weekend.

Quote:
The traditional ways of cider making are still with us today and cider is still appreciated by people from all walks of life who enjoy its naturally fruity and refreshing taste.


Carlsberg don't spin bullshit, but if they did.... Oh. Hang on...

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 35694
Location: yes
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    



carlsberg lost my vote when they deleted the valerian from mr churchill's special brew

bibbster



Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 1233
Location: Just a bit inland from Aberaeron
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Lorrainelovesplants wrote:
Cathryn - any time your down this way.

I am looking at Mail order. Its the legalities of selling (licence -wise) that I need to look at.


Perhaps we need a cider buying trip before the end of July...

Nick



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34031
Location: Hereford
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

dpack wrote:


carlsberg lost my vote when they deleted the valerian from mr churchill's special brew


Special Brew remains a fantastic aid to slimming.

Shan



Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 8181
Location: South Wales
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Ugghhh... Valerian smells like Plague Rats.... which our cat happens to adore.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 35694
Location: yes
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

i had a home made hound that was rather(perhaps too) fond of the stuff

Lorrainelovesplants



Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 6514
Location: Dordogne
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 15 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bibbster - need to be quick!

Seriously, I have one more show to do and I will be out of cider I think! I have 7 bottles of still cider left (out of everything I pressed)so tomorrow, I am bottling.... my last bit of cider.
I dont even have the little bit I reserved for me - its all going in the blend....

bibbster



Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 1233
Location: Just a bit inland from Aberaeron
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 15 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Lorrainelovesplants wrote:
Bibbster - need to be quick!

Seriously, I have one more show to do and I will be out of cider I think! I have 7 bottles of still cider left (out of everything I pressed)so tomorrow, I am bottling.... my last bit of cider.
I dont even have the little bit I reserved for me - its all going in the blend....


Have to be next year then

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