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Meat curing

 
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jema
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 26565
Location: escaped from Swindon
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 16 12:59 am    Post subject: Meat curing  Reply with quote    

Interesting article.

http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_technique/curing_meats.html

I'm getting back into the curing/smoking arena

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 33086
Location: yes
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 16 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

interesting but a lot of never, always, my way or death etc etc .

my tried and trusted mummification methods would make him scream but they work well, are safe and tasty and as my 7 yr old dead pig proves are long lasting.

imho sea salt (and maybe some spices and/or anti-oxidant fruit ), air, sun, smoke and a dead critter are quite an adequate set of ingredients.

i use a variety of techniques and process conditions [ some almost certainly go back to prehistory ] many of which would make him scream (pig in a blanket smoker under a tree or shooing chooks away from a shredded roadkill deer sun drying on chicken wire over a tiny smoke fire does not fit his parameters) but the basic plan is cure and dry , store, eat.

nobody died or even got slightly poorly and i have never lost a batch but i can see his point in stating exact amounts and conditions as some folk seem to need both detail and tickbox assurances that the process and product is "supermarket" approved.

his insistence on oxidising agents in the cure to avoid death seems rather ott as i never do and nor did many of the ancestors and we all survived and thrived.

who said this

"18. What makes red meat and processed meat increase the risk of cancer?

Meat consists of multiple components, such as haem iron. Meat can also contain chemicals that form during meat processing or cooking. For instance, carcinogenic chemicals that form during meat processing include N-nitroso compounds and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Cooking of red meat or processed meat also produces heterocyclic aromatic amines as well as other chemicals including polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, which are also found in other foods and in air pollution. Some of these chemicals are known or suspected carcinogens, but despite this knowledge it is not yet fully understood how cancer risk is increased by red meat or processed meat."

which does put his use of nitrite/nitrate into some dought, that said salt/air/smoke cures can also produce nitroso amines and polycyclics but in his way the amines are made higher deliberately.
however long term small risk elevation is not as dramatic as C. Bot. exotoxin but again in an air cure it would be beyond quite tricky to get C. Bot. to grow.

Behemoth



Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 18997
Location: Leeds
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 16 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I've just got a couple on the go. A standard brine (Fergus Henderson) with a hint of Christmas spices for brisket corned beef and tongue. And a sugar/salt/spice dry cure rub for a bit of a salmon cut (Elizabeth David). No nitrites involved. All in a fridge. All will be cooked. I'm not overly worried about killing myself.

Midlandsman



Joined: 22 May 2014
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 16 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

dpack wrote:

"18. What makes red meat and processed meat increase the risk of cancer?

Meat consists of multiple components, such as haem iron. Meat can also contain chemicals that form during meat processing or cooking. For instance, carcinogenic chemicals that form during meat processing include N-nitroso compounds and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Cooking of red meat or processed meat also produces heterocyclic aromatic amines as well as other chemicals including polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, which are also found in other foods and in air pollution. Some of these chemicals are known or suspected carcinogens, but despite this knowledge it is not yet fully understood how cancer risk is increased by red meat or processed meat."

which does put his use of nitrite/nitrate into some dought, that said salt/air/smoke cures can also produce nitroso amines and polycyclics but in his way the amines are made higher deliberately.
however long term small risk elevation is not as dramatic as C. Bot. exotoxin but again in an air cure it would be beyond quite tricky to get C. Bot. to grow.


It should be noted that this is referring to cured and uncured meat. Your no nitrite/nitrate cured meat would also fall into this category.

You'll note that many of the items listed as examples contain no cure:

World Health Organisation wrote:
Examples of processed meat include hot dogs (frankfurters), ham, sausages, corned beef, and biltong or beef jerky as well as canned meat and meat-based preparations and sauces.


MM

Midlandsman



Joined: 22 May 2014
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 16 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Mmm...

WHO say that 34,000 deaths per year worldwide are attributable to diets high in processed meat.

Researchers from Tufts University, the Harvard School of Public Health, Brigham and Women's Hospital, Harvard Medical School, and the University of Washington in the US, and the Cambridge Institute of Public Health and Imperial College London in the UK. High-salt diet linked to 1.6 million heart deaths.

Just saying.

MM

wellington womble



Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 14834
Location: East Midlands
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 16 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Presumably not because of improper curing? As part of a poor diet, I'd imagine that's a huge underestimate.

My FIL was a food technologist, and reckoned the leading cause of botulism was home canned/bottled tomatoes.

Nick



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 33710
Location: Hereford
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 16 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Nope. It's from wounds in injected drug users.

It's almost zero, in any case.

jema
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 26565
Location: escaped from Swindon
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 16 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I have gone and got one of these.

https://hotsmoked.co.uk/proq-cold-smoke-generator.html

Its a crazy price for what it is, but an initial test on my own oak dust proved highly effective.
In the past I have found cold smoking to be quite a "needy" operation, and this looks to make it a lot simpler and cost effective.

Midlandsman



Joined: 22 May 2014
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 16 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

It's a fantastic piece of kit. You can get 12+ hours of smoke off about 100gm of dust.

MM

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